Help identifying old Claud Butler

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Looking at a blurred 1940 catalogue, Constrictor rims were used on CBs, Colin. The war messed things up. Not many bikes made as metals went to helping the war effort. Not sure when CB started making bikes again but 46-47 could be feasible. Wonder if it could be a Super Velo?

Simon

 

[Losgaintir]

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Hello Simon,
Many thanks for your efforts over this, much appreciated.
Rear wheels are 40 spoke, Sturmey Archer hub, marked Aw and 64
Front wheel is 32 spoke, hub is marked H.R. Pattern, over Prov. Pat and with small oiler in the centre of the hub.
A couple more images of the front fork crown and seat tube clamp
Colin

 

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The rear hub definitely newer but doesn't mean the rims are. Could of been rebuilt at some point. Is it 3 or 4 speed? Not seen the fork crown detail like that before Colin. If you take it apart there could be a serial number matching the frame number on the fork steer tube. Usually a way of telling its had replacement forks. Still worth rebuilding. If your going to repaint it look up H Lloyd for CB transfers. What's it say on the seat tube? Under the plastic pump clips. Not Reynolds tubing? Probably Accles and Polock instead. Some manufacturers used either or a mix of tubing. AP tubing can have a logo stamped in slightly on their tubing.

Simon

 

[Losgaintir]

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Hi Simon,
The little transfer near the top of the seat tube, is Rustproofed by special process

Would it help, if I were to measure the various tubes, diameters, lengths, head and seat angles etc to determine a model?

Colin

 

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They rustproofed the better end bikes then so that's good to know. Won't rust and helps it survive.
Measuring tubes probably won't help to ID what you have as it could be made for anyone. Seat and headtube angles might help though?
The joys of trying to find out what it is. Sometimes easy but can be a mission.

Simon

 

[Losgaintir]

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Hi Simon,
Will check the head and seat angles and post results tomorrow.
Colin

 

[Losgaintir]

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Have just checked some dimensions and here are the results.
Seat angle 70 degrees
Head angle 73 degrees
Wheel base (hub centre to hub centre) 41"
Bottom bracket height (with 26" wheels) 10.5"
Front Fork offset 2.5"
Seat Pin (alloy) 27.1/27.2 m.m.
Seat tube and Down tube 1.125"
Top tube 1"
Head tube 33.3m.m.
Seat stay 1/2" tapered and fluted at top
Hope this will help with identification
Colin

 

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Hi Colin, pretty standard measurements for CBs it seems. Looking at 1940 and 48 onwards catalogues. As good as Norman Kilgarif's site is, there's nothing definitive. I've had the same problem with a F H Grubb. Still nothing definite on it.
With the frame and wheels you have it will make an excellent build.
Let us know how you get on here. Joining the V-CC can help if the marque specialist has any clue's as to what you have. I've found good and not brilliant with help with some of mine with the V-CC. Information can be limited or plentiful.
Good luck and welcome to an addiction

Simon.

 

[Losgaintir]

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Hello Simon,
Like you, I have checked through various Catalogues, on a number of different sites.
A variety of models, exhibit some of my frame features but none all on the same bike!
The nearest I got was the 1949 Catalogue, which showed features 5, 7, 10 and 13 as options on different frames.
I did consider joining the V.C.C. in the hope that they may have a resident Claud Butler marque expert, and may try and check this before joining.
From your comments, it sounds as if you would consider this Frame/ Hub combination, a suitable basis to start a restoration?
My preliminary efforts at sourcing parts of the approximate vintage have not been too successful.
They are available at a price!!!. I found one pair of pedals at £650, and they were used!
Do vintage/classic bike jumbles exist and are they a good source of parts for older, more interesting machines.
Once again, my apologies for the daft questions, but I know absolutely nothing about older bicycles
Colin

 

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Hi Colin, bike jumbles are around and the V-CC hold a few and they have a for sale section at the end of their magazine. Sourcing parts can be a challenge especially with ebay and some crazy prices!!!? Depends on the part, condition and rarity. Finding NOS parts is getting harder but they're out there and amazes my what's still around 30s-50s wise. They made stuff to last then but now might need re-chroming or polishing.
There is a bike market in south London somewhere every Sunday but I've not been and not sure how much vintage parts are there.
If you don't ask you can't gather knowledge so ask away. I'm still learning.

Simon