Another french classic : 1938 Narcisse
- Thread starter bduc61
- Start date
Re: Re:
yes - they are not as frequent as the MAFAC ones but there have been some
From what I have seen , most that can be found were mounted on midmarket bikes
from time to time on ebay
I would rather say , if MAFAC are seen as a majority, its possibly because they were more efficient :?: :idea:
There is a much rarer version of CLB - never seen one in flesh
here one ebay seller believes he holds a treasure :facepalm:
http://www.ebay.fr/itm/CLB-Brake-Set-Ca ... 1624742041
John J":2wwfll30 said:
yes - they are not as frequent as the MAFAC ones but there have been some
From what I have seen , most that can be found were mounted on midmarket bikes
from time to time on ebay
I would rather say , if MAFAC are seen as a majority, its possibly because they were more efficient :?: :idea:
There is a much rarer version of CLB - never seen one in flesh
here one ebay seller believes he holds a treasure :facepalm:
http://www.ebay.fr/itm/CLB-Brake-Set-Ca ... 1624742041
Blackbike
Retro Guru
Re: Re:
Your straddle cable hangers are very interesting they look very similar to René Herse straddle cable hangers, but I believe your set predates his parts as they are slightly different at the cable pull mounting. Was René Herse supplying parts in 1938?
Here is my reproduction hanger set for comparison.
: Mike
bduc61":3b36rukt said:
Your straddle cable hangers are very interesting they look very similar to René Herse straddle cable hangers, but I believe your set predates his parts as they are slightly different at the cable pull mounting. Was René Herse supplying parts in 1938?
Here is my reproduction hanger set for comparison.
: Mike
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Those GB look so similar to Shimano's 1983 teeny tiny 600 cantilevers!
Re: Re:
Indeed these look like Herse ones ! They are - well in a certain sense :idea:
see here
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/herse/
This very model of speedy cantilever evolved into the later Herse cantilevers
Herse according to Jan Heine was very close to Narcisse. He apparently worked there end of the 30's before opening his own shop in 1939/40 ( I have not read something very definite about this date)
Before that he had a go at manufacturing parts , such as these brakes sold as speedy but not under his name
I strongly "suspect" it was not of his and only making - was it a joint venture with someone else ? probably
as at the same time , he was advertising pedals - this time under his name -
see the advertisements of 1938 in a page of the review " Le cycliste" at the beginning of the post.
I think even his crankset precludes his frames.
And possibly the very first Herses had frames built at Narcisse. So the "loop is closed" :idea:
Blackbike":2ks84kbg said:bduc61":2ks84kbg said:
Your straddle cable hangers are very interesting they look very similar to René Herse straddle cable hangers, but I believe your set predates his parts as they are slightly different at the cable pull mounting. Was René Herse supplying parts in 1938?
Here is my reproduction hanger set for comparison.
: Mike
Indeed these look like Herse ones ! They are - well in a certain sense :idea:
see here
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/herse/
This very model of speedy cantilever evolved into the later Herse cantilevers
Herse according to Jan Heine was very close to Narcisse. He apparently worked there end of the 30's before opening his own shop in 1939/40 ( I have not read something very definite about this date)
Before that he had a go at manufacturing parts , such as these brakes sold as speedy but not under his name
I strongly "suspect" it was not of his and only making - was it a joint venture with someone else ? probably
as at the same time , he was advertising pedals - this time under his name -
see the advertisements of 1938 in a page of the review " Le cycliste" at the beginning of the post.
I think even his crankset precludes his frames.
And possibly the very first Herses had frames built at Narcisse. So the "loop is closed" :idea:
Re:
well it does not look simple
I have undone the bolts , taken ou a few washers and it looks like annular bearings ( not needle one) just pushed inside the bottom bracket and blocking the axle
so I wonder how to take them out :roll:
Slight taping on the axle does not move anything a bit. - would have thought hitting the axle on the other side would push the bearings out but not sure at all about the method and I wonder even what I will gain doing it !
more risk to cause damage than anything ?
your ideas welcome :idea:
well it does not look simple
I have undone the bolts , taken ou a few washers and it looks like annular bearings ( not needle one) just pushed inside the bottom bracket and blocking the axle
so I wonder how to take them out :roll:
Slight taping on the axle does not move anything a bit. - would have thought hitting the axle on the other side would push the bearings out but not sure at all about the method and I wonder even what I will gain doing it !
more risk to cause damage than anything ?
your ideas welcome :idea:
Blackbike
Retro Guru
Re: Re:
Wow... I am very surprised by how nice everything looks in there, and by how much precision machine work was required to fit the outer bearing race(s) to the bottom bracket shell, (two or three piece annular bearings, outer race, ball retainer and balls and inner race). I assume the outer races are press fit into the shell. I assume that the inner race is a very close slip fit on the spindle as the bearing adjustment is performed from this side, I would also assume that the right side inner race sits against a shoulder on the the spindle, and the works is removed from the right hand side after all dust shields and retainers are removed. That being said if the right side is as open as the left side my vote would be to wash out the works with mineral spirits and compressed air, regrease the bearings and see how it works before further disassembly.
Just out of curiosity are the grease seals made of felt?
: Mike
bduc61":2xaumubh said:well it does not look simple
I have undone the bolts , taken ou a few washers and it looks like annular bearings ( not needle one) just pushed inside the bottom bracket and blocking the axle
so I wonder how to take them out :roll:
Slight taping on the axle does not move anything a bit. - would have thought hitting the axle on the other side would push the bearings out but not sure at all about the method and I wonder even what I will gain doing it !
more risk to cause damage than anything ?
your ideas welcome :idea:
Wow... I am very surprised by how nice everything looks in there, and by how much precision machine work was required to fit the outer bearing race(s) to the bottom bracket shell, (two or three piece annular bearings, outer race, ball retainer and balls and inner race). I assume the outer races are press fit into the shell. I assume that the inner race is a very close slip fit on the spindle as the bearing adjustment is performed from this side, I would also assume that the right side inner race sits against a shoulder on the the spindle, and the works is removed from the right hand side after all dust shields and retainers are removed. That being said if the right side is as open as the left side my vote would be to wash out the works with mineral spirits and compressed air, regrease the bearings and see how it works before further disassembly.
Just out of curiosity are the grease seals made of felt?
: Mike
Re:
Well guessed, the grease seals are felt !
and the right side is most probably very similar to the left but without bolts - see pic below - have to undo it
By the way why did you say it could be taken out on the right side ? I would have thought the other way around ?
As to me the bolts compress the left handside spindle part so that it can not move outside to the left - the spindle being blocked against a move towards the right by the right washer blocked by the open ring - the right bearings being blocked to the right by the same washer and to the left by a shoulder on the spindle ! ouch dunno if it is understandable and making sense at the same time :mrgreen:
Well guessed, the grease seals are felt !
and the right side is most probably very similar to the left but without bolts - see pic below - have to undo it
By the way why did you say it could be taken out on the right side ? I would have thought the other way around ?
As to me the bolts compress the left handside spindle part so that it can not move outside to the left - the spindle being blocked against a move towards the right by the right washer blocked by the open ring - the right bearings being blocked to the right by the same washer and to the left by a shoulder on the spindle ! ouch dunno if it is understandable and making sense at the same time :mrgreen:
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