Can we be told in advance about BOTM?
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SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum
Old School Grand Master
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Tazio":mg532b5z said:
gm thinks tazio needs to visit threads other-than-the BOTM thread
SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum
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We_are_Stevo":2apdb27l said:jamabikes":2apdb27l said:come along to the post 98 botm, we let anyone in!
All except anally retentive Ivy League Democrats...
Love this... thanks Rush!!!
SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum
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UNCLEJACK":3161a51s said:after all this, I really can't wait to see what next months category actually is
So no opinions, just this is how working towards my first BOTM submission has affected me.
The idea of submitting has created a deadline and the idea of any sort of deadline has certainly motivated me to go into the garage to do work on the bike that I would have otherwise put off.
It’s made me more attentive to the details on my bike.
It’s made me polish more
But it’s also made me spend more
It’s made me buy bits that I wouldn’t have bought otherwise.
It’s made me strip and rebuild parts that worked perfectly but could have been shinier.
Its caused me stress as I contemplate will I get more votes if I put the factory supplied reflectors back on
It’s made me consider buying NOS tyres that I don’t really want to ride on anyway
It’s made me fret over the paint finish of what is supposed to be a utilitarian machine
It’s made me think about buying foam grips, when BITD we binned them as they were death traps when they flew off in the wet and you ate a big chunk of Japanese formed aluminium
Its stopped me from just actually taking the bike out for a ride, because I needs to have it perfect for the Photo shoot to use for BOTM
And with limited time available in a day, its actually stopped me from training/ riding my other bike whilst I spend time polishing my cranks up.
But it’s made me think that I am handling a piece of history and it’s made me think that the only thing now stopping me from fulfilling those boyhood dreams is going out there and doing it.
So, both pros and cons.
You forgot the "I also spent more money on a new camera lens and the boxing and the plane ticket to get the bike to the mountains... than the bike so I can compete with those that are also rank in file pro-am photography enthusiasts that live in the mountains"
SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum
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mfh126":1ytfkh9j said:I smell Photoshop all over that picture. Those tires are too clean to have been used on a trail!FMJ":1ytfkh9j said:In the end, it's still a mountainbike, and I had it out last Monday and wailed on it on the local trails.
No, they're clean because the bike was on his shoulder while he was hiking on the local trail
pete_mcc":3gmudszg said:marky2484":3gmudszg said:Is Pete Mcc on holiday?
Ha! Amazingly, yes I am
The reason I'm not playing is that this argument has been done to death and I really don't want to "go off on one"... like I do so often.
What I will say is that my last bike to win BOTM was a Klein; the frame & forks cost $300, the cranks cost £35, hubs £20, rims £20 and so on. No special handshakes, no massive budget. The whole bike cost less than the paint job (which was worth every penny).
-My Yeti that won BOTM was a wreck that I bought for £150, the groupset came from a bike shop clearing 'that old rubbish'.
-My Bradbury Manitou that won BOTM was an eBay special for a couple hundred.
-My Fat Ti that won BOTM was a swap with a full suspension bike that I'd bought third hand many, many years ago.
The two bikes that I spent a mint on won nothing.
I like to think that people voted for each of those bikes because they were painstakingly rebuilt, good looking bikes that pushed the right buttons and took people back, not because people were impressed that I could 'flash the cash'. I hope they weren't so shallow to repeatedly vote for what they saw as a pile of cash. If they were then it's them we need to have a go at, not me or other winners who entered the bikes.
Yes, I know I have more money than some but that doesn't mean I am willing to throw money around. I put in legwork, hunt eBay for badly listed items, talk to shop owners, go to swap meets or network. I know many people who can help me and who I help in return. Some people are willing to pay market price on eBay but I'm not, I insist on paying a lot less. My mother always said, "How do rich people get rich? By not wasting money".
I have never sold a single one of my BOTM winners as they were all works of love and passion and would rather eat bread and water for the rest of my life than get rid of them. They were not built for BOTM or for some other validation of my existence by random strangers - they were built for me. Yes some are unridden, but I've not been up to riding for a long time (see above hospital mention), and any way there are some that I will never ride, period and I don't need to explain why to anyone!
My final word is the same thing I have said for the past umpteen years; good bikes are not expensive bikes, bad bikes are not cheap bikes, the two things are truly independent. BOTM is not an 'elitist' thing and it's certainly not a popularity contest (otherwise I'd never have won 1 let alone 4).
Go and look at Sinnermans efforts; they are not wallet buster unobtainium bikes, they are man-hour marathons that have been recognised as stunning efforts with equally good outcomes. As he would say, 'Awesum'!
Alright, I did go off on one in the end, sorry....
Best response yet and bang on the money. Hope you are on the mend my friend.
Si
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pete_mcc":2nec0rk5 said:
You might have done but you're very very correct imho. We'd all like to spend oodles of cash on what people perceive as 'unicorn' bikes but some just haven't got the cash, time or facilities to do it. As for entering a shoddy build, why not? It's the taking part that counts even if you know you're not going to get any votes.
Btw, I have my 'unicorn' bike already and it would take a lot for me to sell it. Probably health reasons for either my son, wife or even maybe me. I don't think I'll put it up for BOTM though (I've never put one in at all); it's very much a rider and very much shows the scars of recent riding and fettling. Isn't that what bikes are for <ducks under the parapet>.
mrkawasaki
Retrobike Rider
Between them, Pete and MikeD have pretty much nailed this hoary old chestnut - let's sticky those wise words.
I have always personally been troubled by BotM and the 'competitive' element that became endemic, fostered by a very few intent on setting a standard that, deliberately or otherwise, would distance their efforts and abilities from the riff raff - tis human nature after all. The early spirit of the BotM was undeniably in encouraging all to show their wares not, as some revisionists would have it, to acquire or build a bike specifically for competition purposes.
Now of course, the game has changed somewhat - the evolution of the self-styled pioneering collectors/investors/builders means they have gone on to finer things and believe they are in a position therefore to question at best, ridicule at worst, others who have not been along for the whole ride or those who innocently step into the beartrap, flush in the early throes of their newfound retromania. Whilst they indeed may be bored by 'inferior' and repetitious bikes being served up, some do take perverse pleasure in exploiting these easy targets, presumably to reinforce their 'superior' status.
This reappropriation of BotM, with frequent referrals to a 'standard' that never existed, is where conflict (aka 'banter') is tediously mined. Throw in some wilful cultural differences (both here at home and global) and away we go! I guess some enjoy a bit of disharmony to brighten their dull days (cue smiley emoticons). However Retrobike has managed to maintain a unique spirit of goodwill despite these flurries - it would appear that this is much to the dismay of some who bemoan it as 'politeness' and an inability to call a 'spade a spade' because inclusion is encouraged before criticism here. It's a fair bet that other well known retro forums would not have been able to cope with the running of a BotM without implosion - for it to still be running on this site after all these years is some sort of credit to the democracy, I guess...
Having said all that, don't surmise I'm against excellence in any way. BotM's value is assured having consistently uncovered some amazing, amazing bikes - all way too 'good' for the likes of my collecting ambitions! I actually believe the competitive element of BotM should be ramped up, as long as it is not at the cost of encouraging others to participate in retrobiking. Maybe there should be a Readers Rides of the Month where all new bikes/builds to the site can be featured before they go into BotM ring, along with encouraging and helpful contributions from the undoubted knowledge base we have here.
I have always personally been troubled by BotM and the 'competitive' element that became endemic, fostered by a very few intent on setting a standard that, deliberately or otherwise, would distance their efforts and abilities from the riff raff - tis human nature after all. The early spirit of the BotM was undeniably in encouraging all to show their wares not, as some revisionists would have it, to acquire or build a bike specifically for competition purposes.
Now of course, the game has changed somewhat - the evolution of the self-styled pioneering collectors/investors/builders means they have gone on to finer things and believe they are in a position therefore to question at best, ridicule at worst, others who have not been along for the whole ride or those who innocently step into the beartrap, flush in the early throes of their newfound retromania. Whilst they indeed may be bored by 'inferior' and repetitious bikes being served up, some do take perverse pleasure in exploiting these easy targets, presumably to reinforce their 'superior' status.
This reappropriation of BotM, with frequent referrals to a 'standard' that never existed, is where conflict (aka 'banter') is tediously mined. Throw in some wilful cultural differences (both here at home and global) and away we go! I guess some enjoy a bit of disharmony to brighten their dull days (cue smiley emoticons). However Retrobike has managed to maintain a unique spirit of goodwill despite these flurries - it would appear that this is much to the dismay of some who bemoan it as 'politeness' and an inability to call a 'spade a spade' because inclusion is encouraged before criticism here. It's a fair bet that other well known retro forums would not have been able to cope with the running of a BotM without implosion - for it to still be running on this site after all these years is some sort of credit to the democracy, I guess...
Having said all that, don't surmise I'm against excellence in any way. BotM's value is assured having consistently uncovered some amazing, amazing bikes - all way too 'good' for the likes of my collecting ambitions! I actually believe the competitive element of BotM should be ramped up, as long as it is not at the cost of encouraging others to participate in retrobiking. Maybe there should be a Readers Rides of the Month where all new bikes/builds to the site can be featured before they go into BotM ring, along with encouraging and helpful contributions from the undoubted knowledge base we have here.
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