GT XIZANG yay!!! cracks everywhere boooo

[i-am-iron-man]

Re: teach me,

I'm a welder by trade. If it was alu it would not be a problem to fix. So what makes it irrepairable because its titanium? I admittedly have done know titanium welding at all, but a bloke at work used to work for Westland Helicopters. He said that in theory nothing is irrepairable given the right wire/rods and an appropriate set. Is he wrong/winding me up? I might be ill informed and it may be scrap,but I doubt it.

yes it can be done , but need to be done by soeone who knows what he is doing .
I am sure Rody explained on here the technical bits .

Definitely repairable, but there might be some legwork involved. I tried to get a titanium Raleigh Special Products frame repaired after I [inadvertently] bought a crashed one. I've had welding work done on alu frames at BAE Systems before and I tried to get them to fix it but I didn't get very far. Whoever does the work will want to know what grade titanium it is too.

If someone wants it badly enough and the price is right I'd have a punt on it. Might be worth phoning around, speak to some people "in the know" and see what they have to say - try and get a feel for on prices and how much travel would be involved first.

 

[peanut]

I wouldn't have a titanium frame if it was free.
They have a serious design flaw weakness in the headtube to seat and downtube arrangement. Strain in this area is considerable in any frame but lugless butt weld titanium headtube without reinforcement is asking for trouble.
There are dozens of similar failures littering the web particularly Litespeed frames . Always the headtube :roll: don't waste your money.
http://www.twi.co.uk/content/bpweldtis01.html

 

[SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum]

I wouldn't have a titanium frame if it was free.
They have a serious design flaw weakness in the headtube to seat and downtube arrangement. Strain in this area is considerable in any frame but lugless butt weld titanium headtube without reinforcement is asking for trouble.
There are dozens of similar failures littering the web particularly Litespeed frames . Always the headtube :roll: don't waste your money.
http://www.twi.co.uk/content/bpweldtis01.html

Three questions PEANUT! How old are you? and have you ever owned and ridden a titanium frame bike for any length of time? What are your frames built from.... cast boron steel?
You don't know what you're talking about...how would it differ from TIG welded steel in stresses and how many million mountain bikes in steel and for that matter aluminum have been TIG welded without additional gussets or reinforcement. Time you take a metallurgy class. What you are failing to recognize is what the bike was designed for. It's a xc racing frame...not designed to be flown, jumped, freeridden or smacked into trees and let go of in mid flight...in other words abused. Get a brain! I've had one of these frames since 1991 with no problems...zero...and I can't begin to imagine how many 10's of thousands of miles I have on it. If you think you are so right about this you'd better start sharing your knowledge with all the engineers at Litespeed/Merlin/ABG, Sandvik, Crisp, Seven, Moots, Kent Eriksen and a whole host of others because they need to be as smart as you? LOL!

 

[GoldenEraMTB]

I wouldn't have a titanium frame if it was free.
They have a serious design flaw weakness in the headtube to seat and downtube arrangement. Strain in this area is considerable in any frame but lugless butt weld titanium headtube without reinforcement is asking for trouble.
There are dozens of similar failures littering the web particularly Litespeed frames . Always the headtube :roll: don't waste your money.
http://www.twi.co.uk/content/bpweldtis01.html

hmmmm...don't know about this...

 

[peanut]

Three questions PEANUT! How old are you? and have you ever owned and ridden a titanium frame bike for any length of time? What are your frames built from.... cast boron steel?
You don't know what you're talking about.... Get a brain! If you think you are so right about this you'd better start sharing your knowledge with all the engineers at Litespeed/Merlin/ABG, Sandvik, Crisp, Seven, Moots, Kent Eriksen and a whole host of others because they need to be as smart as you? LOL!

I imagine that you are a juvenile judging by your lack of command of the English language and your inability to form a reasoned argument without resorting to personal insults so I'll excuse your ignorance on the subject.

Try using a google search for TI Frame failure and do a little research on the subject ,that way when you express an opinion it will be better informed
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=litespeed+frame+failure&btnG=Search&meta=

incidentally I rode my first titanium frame bike in 1980 probably before you were born ! and designed and braized my first set of tubes in 1978

 

[SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum]

Wow...I kneel before thee!

Peanut....FWIW my beard's as gray as yours. It's just that your original statement had that definitive "I'm the expert twang" to it and had nothing to back it up except "search and see". You can search and find failure in everything that's been made in the history of man including man himself. That's most of the problem with manufactured items some engineer's looking at tables saying "oh this will work" but he never gets his butt of the tables to see if it will hold up. Sure over the years there have been plenty of designs that never should have made it to the show room floor. Back in my days in the industry if an item had a 4-5% failure rate it was quickly changed or replaced quite quickly with something else design wise.

So, in your field of expertise what makes a TIG welded titanium frame any different that a short butted thin wall Chromoly steel frame that's TIG welded? There are a lot more TIG welded steel frames out there than Ti and they too fail and are also corrosive. Shouldn't we then be more concerned about 100 to 1 or more Chromoly vs. Ti ratio out on the road that people continue to ride? How should Ti frames be built in your opinion? Is anyone out there right now doing it correctly?

I certainly can't seem to find near as many cases of bantered about discussions on forum threads about Ti frame failures as I can about steel, aluminum or carbon so I guess I still prefer Ti and will continue riding it the way it's built.

 

[mynchiboy]

Wow :shock:

Just been reading this thread and couldn't resist this, the question is who wants to be 'aggressive cat' and who is 'defensive'?

 

[peanut]

So, in your field of expertise what makes a TIG welded titanium frame any different that a short butted thin wall Chromoly steel frame that's TIG welded? .

Trying to stay on topic here
I would say the TI frame is inherently the weaker of the two options and almost impossible to repair whereas a steel frame is cheap and easy to repair .Anyone could do it .


The question is academic anyway .Why would anyone buy a modern mass produced TIG welded steel frame when they could buy an elegant strong hand built lugged one with charater and heritage.?

I think you are posting on the wrong forum . this forum is for retro bikes not modern mass produced tig welded rubbish from the Far east

 

[SeeingisBelievingGTMuseum]

Trying to stay on topic here
I would say the TI frame is inherently the weaker of the two options....

The question is academic anyway .Why would anyone buy a modern mass produced TIG welded steel frame when they could buy an elegant strong hand built lugged one with charater and heritage.?

I think you are posting on the wrong forum . this forum is for retro bikes not modern mass produced tig welded rubbish from the Far east

For what it's worth I was retailing both USA, Japanese ans Taiwanese built TIG welded mountain bikes as early as 1985 and would consider those classic, vintage and retro at this point. I see a lot more modern what you call "Asian rubbish" on this site than I do retro.

Peanut you're obviously a big fan of lugged bikes and that I admire

 

[Russell]

Peanut, considering that on one of your threads you jumped down my throat for making 'assumptions' about you when I didn't know you (despite my comments being well meaning and actually factually correct) I'd say you were on dodgy ground here!

People need to chill a bit.