Dave Russell or not?

I have a handsome bike which is branded as a Dave Russell and would like to check it’s origin before having it refinished.

It does bear some resemblances to other Dave Russell-badged frames from the early 1970s, such as the lugs, the cylindrical cable stops and the front forks. However, the wrap-over stay top and the frame number itself do not match with what is normally associated with this maker. I understand that a number of other frame builders built for DR so that does confuse the matter.

It has recently been refinished (poorly) by others so there is no history there.

I read what there is on Classic Lightweights and then contacted Old Ned, who has owned a few of these frames. He suggested that I put this question to the collective knowledge of the forum. I can put some more photos up if that would help.

I would appreciate any helpful comments that might shed some light on the question, “Is it a Dave Russell or not?” Thanks very much.

Hi, sorry I've not got back to you by e-mail - but I've been pondering this in the meantime and your post has prompted me. To be honest, I can't say for certain. It's the full wrap seat stays that are concerning me but I can't say for certain that Dave (or his freelance builders) didn't do this. The chainstays also look quite long, all the DR frames I've seen are quite short wheelbase but again, I can't definitively state he didn't supply frames like this. One of my thought is that it could be a Holdsworth? A number might assist with this.

Hopefully someone else will be able to add something. I'm sure I heard that Dave's son has some records?

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Thanks for your feedback Old Ned,

I did see a Dave Russell on eBay that bore some resemblence to mine in terms of geometry, wheelbase, lug type and stay tops (although the latter are not identical, the wrap over is much thinner).
Does it look similar to you?

Probably is a Dave Russell. He built to the customer's spec so he also built touring bikes and for cyclocross too, of which I had one some years ago. Details such as the wrap over seat stay would often be specified by the customer, and the fine work here suggests a small builder. The frame number, it's type and position should confirm the identity, if you can find out more about these details.

It might be worth emailing Rikki of Pankhurst Cycles in Pangbourne, as he knew Dave Russell quite well.

Just a thought... Could be built by Bill Gray. He often used that type of wrapover for the seat stays and was known to build frames for Dave Russell on occasion. He also used his own frame number system, or a suffix, although I don't know how the sequence went.

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I'd say Holdsworth. That still makes it a good quality frame. It was their later ones that had build quality issues in particular the forks.

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That one upthread on ebay has a great vibe- I could look at that all day...for some reason.. :?