Petition to make UK royal family pay for Buck Palace repairs

[hamster]

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There's always been polarisation of wealth, and always will be. 10x, 100x, 1000x, the gap doesn't matter- what government should be doing is helping those at the bottom improve their life chances. Take them out of tax altogether. Scrap the contrived tax credits rigmarole. Provide subsidised training or college. Work on attracting inward investment to create jobs.

You can't make the poor richer by giving them money. And you certainly can't do it by taking money from the wealthy.

Relative inequality is measured by the Gini Coefficient. There is good empirical evidence the unequal societies are more stressed and society as a whole less happy. The rich fear crime for example far more in unequal societies than equal ones.

I disagree with your final remark. We've had 20 years of believing that trickle-down economics works. Instead the top 1% have got relatively and absolutely richer...and nothing has trickled down at all.

 

[technodup]

Re: Re:

I disagree with your final remark. We've had 20 years of believing that trickle-down economics works. Instead the top 1% have got relatively and absolutely richer...and nothing has trickled down at all.

I should have added something else you'll disagree with, that imo it's immoral to tax someone at a higher rate than someone else, purely because they have more to take.

I'd far rather government 'incentivised' big Phil Green, or Stelios or just successful local people to give talks in schools or colleges. Or to mentor young people or start up businesses. These guys understand time is more valuable than money, and if they put more of theirs to use to inspire youngsters we could have a more productive and successful future.

In spite of what some may think I wish all the success to young people, low wagers etc. But I have a very different view on where success comes from.

But yay, tax the rich etc.

 

[The History Man]

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The thread itself is little more than first world problems.

I doubt a man in a mud hut with no safe water, food, healthcare,education, transport etc would view any of us with free healthcare, roads, large screen tv, £700 iphones, sky, university educations, clean running water, buses, trains. a social benefits system giving free housing, free money, support for the most disabled...as oppressed by the man

And the ability to moan about anything that bothers us without getting got.

 

[KDM]

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And the ability to moan about anything that bothers us without getting got.

I don't know who "got" is but I hope you both will be happy with each other

 

[Harryburgundy]

Re: Re:

There's always been polarisation of wealth, and always will be. 10x, 100x, 1000x, the gap doesn't matter- what government should be doing is helping those at the bottom improve their life chances. Take them out of tax altogether. Scrap the contrived tax credits rigmarole. Provide subsidised training or college. Work on attracting inward investment to create jobs.

You can't make the poor richer by giving them money. And you certainly can't do it by taking money from the wealthy.

Relative inequality is measured by the Gini Coefficient. There is good empirical evidence the unequal societies are more stressed and society as a whole less happy. The rich fear crime for example far more in unequal societies than equal ones.

I disagree with your final remark. We've had 20 years of believing that trickle-down economics works. Instead the top 1% have got relatively and absolutely richer...and nothing has trickled down at all.

Totally agree Hamster. I'm trying to reconcile technodub's opinion that the level of inequality in a society 'doesn't matter'. Even a rudementary grasp of socioeconomics demonstrates that it very much does bloody matter.

You can't make the poor richer by giving them money. And you certainly can't do it by taking money from the wealthy.

Erm, yes you can. And, erm, yes you can.

It's always going to be shit at the bottom. The key is understanding how to get off the bottom, and that comes with education, training, skills, state assistance where needed

State assistance where needed? Is it not the duty of the state to educate, offer training and skills, whether academic or vocational?

 

[brocklanders023]

Re: Re:

I should have added something else you'll disagree with, that imo it's immoral to tax someone at a higher rate than someone else, purely because they have more to take.

What about taxing someone at a higher rate than someone else, purely because they have less to take so can't afford to employ someone to 'manage' their tax affairs?

How about getting Phillip Green to stop stealing people's pensions just so he can stuff even larger wads of cash in his disgusting, fat head before we offer him any more 'incentives'?

 

[technodup]

Re: Re:

Totally agree Hamster. I'm trying to reconcile technodub's opinion that the level of inequality in a society 'doesn't matter'. Even a rudementary grasp of socioeconomics demonstrates that it very much does bloody matter.

It only matters if you're forever wringing your hands about the 'injustice' of it all. I couldn't give a toss. It's really quite simple, if people want to get richer they know what they have to do. Study, work longer/harder/smarter than others, ask questions and take risks. That's not for some people, which is fine. But don't moan about being skint. Or moan on behalf of others that they are skint.

Erm, yes you can. And, erm, yes you can.

No you can't. Because the wealthy aren't enough, you need to take it from the middle, and the not so wealthy, and the not much above poor themselves. Which leaves you with the ridiculous situation we have now with the working poor sometimes poorer than the non working poor. Not to mention the wealthy are a bit smart and mobile to allow it. I'll not bother with the moral argument.

Is it not the duty of the state to educate, offer training and skills, whether academic or vocational?

It is. And it's the individual's duty to make the best of what they are offered. I don't see it as the state's duty to fund in perpetuity those who can't be arsed.

How about getting Phillip Green to stop stealing people's pensions just so he can stuff even larger wads of cash in his disgusting, fat head before we offer him any more 'incentives'?

Incentivise was in quotes for a reason. I didn't mean a positive incentive.

Anyway this is way OT for Buckingham Palace roof repairs. Although as a still working 90 year old Queenie's not the worst example to people.

 

[KDM]

Re: Re:

State assistance where needed? Is it not the duty of the state to educate, offer training and skills, whether academic or vocational?

No it's not, it is expected they should offer and generally they do but offering it and people using it are two different things. Prison is full of people who were offered education but chose not to take it

As to taxing someone at a higher rate, why? so you can keep people in their political class? Why not simply have one fixed rate across all the board? A millionaire at 15% is still going to put in far more than my 15%

 

[CTK]

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...

 

[highlandsflyer]

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Interesting to see the opinions on this thread, and those on others recently.

Seems there is a general slide to the right in society right now.

There are good reasons homophobia, racism, misogyny and all the other intolerances became frowned upon.

We are not enhancing society by unravelling the years of progress.

I am sure the pendulum shall swing again in time, but it is a hateful movement towards divisive and cold attitudes that is occurring, and trying to take it in a tongue in cheek manner only gets one so far.

Time to start kicking some ass, drop the anchor and turf a few of these swivel eyed fascist scum overboard. We may need to wait a while before the wind of change frees us from the doldrums, but it will.

F Trump.

F May.

F Marine Le Pen.