electric van and when to make the change?

CassidyAce

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legrandefromage":nntwxp4v said:
No point missed here, £61900 is in the unobtainable bracket regardless of motive power

It still wont be as cheap to run as https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-fiesta- ... Sw3P1fukU6

Let's consider that Ford Fiesta for a minute. It's done 138,000 miles and has quoted CO2 emissions of 110g/km. That means it pumps out 177.1g of CO2 per mile (110g x 1.61) or 1kg of CO2 every 5.65 miles. Now, given that the vehicle in question has done 138,000 miles, that means that it has pumped out (177.1g x 138,000 =) 24439800g = 24,439.8kg = 24.44 metric tons of CO2 during its time in use, not including manufacturing costs, factoring in the possibly optimistic emissions figures, etc. Looked at another way, its CO2 emissions amount to roughly 20x its own weight (quoted at 1118 kg) in roughly 11 years. That's just one little car at the more fuel efficient end of the spectrum.

There are thought to be about 1.4 billion cars in use on the planet. CO2 takes between 20 and 200 years for 65%-80% to dissipate in the sea. The rest takes thousands of years to dissipate. In short, that's a hell of a lot of CO2 for a hell of a long time. But how many people plan a short drive and think that their actions are producing a kilo of CO2 every five of six miles, or that, over a lifetime, their driving alone is producing perhaps 60 metric tons of CO2, some of which will still be circulating in thousands of years time? I doubt if there's anyone here who actually wants to cause that much pollution.

Sure, the switch away from fossil fuel based vehicles might be awkward, inconvenient and expensive but surely, in good conscience, it has to happen. That might involve alternative energy sources, reduced travel or a combination of the two.
 

dyna-ti

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Ford Fiesta's
Or UK cars mean little to nothing. Britain is really small compared to other countries and if all of Britain went green, and if we produced not a single contaminate, it wouldnt make the slightest bit of difference.

Broken Britain needs an income, and the only source is its people. They'll raise funds from people who cannot afford to buy a new Ecar, then eventually when those are banned completely, they'll raise from taxation, and from exorbitant electricity costs.
Even if every amp or volt was produced from wind or wave, the public would still pay through the nose for it as the treasury gets its big slice.
 

mk one

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I dont like the idea of Electric/battery cars, they bring their own problems, but, i also think the time of fueled cars needs to end, and though there are alternatives with a lot less impact i see it as at least breaking a worse habit so to speak.

Maybe an option for jonnyboy's bike shop :xmas-big-grin:
 

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jonnyboy666

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hmm . . . yeah, not quite my cup of tea, truth be told i'd love a retro US pick up truck, always loved this from the Fall Guy

wonder if you can get a electric conversion with a speaker in it to make engine noises . . . or i could sit behind the wheel making the noises myself!

:LOL:
 

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CassidyAce

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dyna-ti":2211kf3e said:
Ford Fiesta's
Or UK cars mean little to nothing. Britain is really small compared to other countries and if all of Britain went green, and if we produced not a single contaminate, it wouldnt make the slightest bit of difference.
The UK accounts for less than 1% of the world's population but contains just short of 3% of the world's cars. With about 1/35th of the world's cars, you could say the UK has the dubious honour of punching above its weight on this front. It's not the worst offender but it's not insignificant either.

As for the economics, it's complicated . . .
 

legrandefromage

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Re: Re:

CassidyAce":3nuca8km said:
legrandefromage":3nuca8km said:
No point missed here, £61900 is in the unobtainable bracket regardless of motive power

It still wont be as cheap to run as https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ford-fiesta- ... Sw3P1fukU6

Let's consider that Ford Fiesta for a minute. It's done 138,000 miles and has quoted CO2 emissions of 110g/km. That means it pumps out 177.1g of CO2 per mile (110g x 1.61) or 1kg of CO2 every 5.65 miles. Now, given that the vehicle in question has done 138,000 miles, that means that it has pumped out (177.1g x 138,000 =) 24439800g = 24,439.8kg = 24.44 metric tons of CO2 during its time in use, not including manufacturing costs, factoring in the possibly optimistic emissions figures, etc. Looked at another way, its CO2 emissions amount to roughly 20x its own weight (quoted at 1118 kg) in roughly 11 years. That's just one little car at the more fuel efficient end of the spectrum.

There are thought to be about 1.4 billion cars in use on the planet. CO2 takes between 20 and 200 years for 65%-80% to dissipate in the sea. The rest takes thousands of years to dissipate. In short, that's a hell of a lot of CO2 for a hell of a long time. But how many people plan a short drive and think that their actions are producing a kilo of CO2 every five of six miles, or that, over a lifetime, their driving alone is producing perhaps 60 metric tons of CO2, some of which will still be circulating in thousands of years time? I doubt if there's anyone here who actually wants to cause that much pollution.

Sure, the switch away from fossil fuel based vehicles might be awkward, inconvenient and expensive but surely, in good conscience, it has to happen. That might involve alternative energy sources, reduced travel or a combination of the two.


....and an electric Polestar emits 24 metric tons of carbon during production (an XC90 is 14 tons)

I'd rather have the fiesta because in the real world, its cheap to insure, service and use

That real world thing is where normal people live, not Marketing world. Marketing World is a universe where anything over 4 minutes old simply ceases to register. Marketing world it looks like a BMW advert or an Audi advert where everyone lives in large houses and they laugh at each other as one presses the start button on their 530D and the cam chain never EVER falls off...
 

legrandefromage

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and another thing! :LOL:

Whilst we're all trying to be green-ish here, I'm sure the stats show its more environmentally friendly keep an existing car on the road rather than buy a new one.

You know you dont see many older trucks on the road? They get regular inspections and cover around 50-70,000 miles a year at about 9-13mpg, the ones I work on have been anything up to 1,100,000km and still in regular use

The old ones get exported.

These and thousands of old vehicles get sold to the Middle East and the African continent where their catalytic converters are removed and many parts used for emission reduction are taken off. So all the efforts here are worth buggerall in the grand scheme of things as once they are out of the UK and Europe, no-one gives a ****

https://www.theafricalogistics.com/2020 ... -report-2/

There are rumbles and plans are being brought in to limit the age of vehicle imports but until that happens all of our once cherished old bangers are worth far more money as exports rather than t being scrapped for their base materials.

So stick that up your electric EV
 

legrandefromage

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This is all car manufacturer whinging but they do raise some valid points

https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish ... ims/209636

and some proper investigation rather than shouty eadline click bait

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesmorri ... fuel-hype/

It is all a mess and there is no easy answer but its a generation thing not an overnight solution. Just ask a Range Rover owner as to why they have that vehicle and not that £1600 Fiesta and they'll either laugh or try to punch you.

https://www.parkers.co.uk/land-rover/ra ... ing-costs/

Theres too much sneering and snidyness when it comes to those that simply cant afford to buy something new and shiny or expensive and that is what has to be educated out of the world.

Take away the status symbolism (ooh, Torqless will like that word) of vehicles, make a car as a bottom of the list form of transport rather than driving from one side of a village to the other as my neighbours do.

But it wont happen, theres too many that see their choice of car as trying to show who they are and how successful or important they are.

Heres the stats for a 2020/1 Ford Raptor

10.5sec 0-62mph, 106mph top speed, 31.7mpg, 233g/km CO2

31.7mpg

2510kg

How the **** is that still allowed to be sold? How on earth is the UK going to go green when these are being pumped out onto the roads

Get rid of that tax bracket and these will dissappear quicker than you can say 'cheeeese'
 

brocklanders023

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It all depends on your personal situation though, doesn't it? I lease my electric i3s through a work scheme. Due to a BIK reduction and residual values my 40k rrp car actually costs me less per month than a 15k rrp Fiesta and that's before you factor in the saving I make on fuel.

To take this further, if I borrowed 8k and bought second hand the cost of the loan, insurance, fuel and maintenance would be more than the cost of the i3s per month.

I appreciate that not everyone has access to such schemes (although plenty will) but for me going electric was actually the cheaper option. I charge it at home via a 3 pin plug so it's no more inconvenient than any other car. It was a no brainer and the biggest factor in why I went electric.
 
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