SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
Santini branded Italian road bike, most likely from the early 80s. The frame is fully chromed and made with Columbus SL tubing. It's 60cm c-c ST and 59cm c-c TT. Frame weights 1960g and fork 690g
Early 80s Santini
- Thread starter SteelNipple
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SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
vtwinvince
Senior Retro Guru
I like that, nice lugwork.
@SteelNipple correct.
Trying to view your images; I have no signal or high speed data so it will happen when it happens.
It is certainly the Santini marque referenced in Forte dei Marmi per its lug cut-outs. The BB shell is a stock design and does not help indicate builder. I assume the "59" is frame size (usually seat tube, or seat x top tube; but not TT only); the "60" (if measured as you did) might still be obscured by paint or the seat tube was measued differently by the builder. The gouges in the shell seem to be just that and not marks made by the builder unless he was an incoherent madman.
I could not view the final set of photos, but doubt that it would bring a builder to mind since all frame parts (e.g. Prugnat lugs) seen thus far are commonly used by many builders for many years in the '70s and '80s.
What is the seat post diameter? I am surprised to see a frame that large made with "SL" tubing. It was not really spec'd for larger frames due to more flex (I rode a 57 c-c "SL" frame and could readily flex it as a small 135 pound guy on an oversized frame), and durability for heavier riders. Some builders would use a mix of "SL" & "SP", but you would need to hear that from "the horse's mouth" as to what frames were in what area. Seat tube is best bet for at least determining if at least was an "SL" (27.2mm seat pin) gauged tube, or "SP" (27.0mm seat pin).
How did you determine it to be Columbus tubing? Other quality tubesets were out there at that time and the better lightweight sets would still take 27.2mm pins. I would certainly err towards Columbus, but without some sign (stamped tube/steerer ridges) I could not guess. It could easily be Oria tubing which had some lightweight sets comparable to Columbus; Falck would be my last guess for Italian tubesets. Given the total weight for frame and fork it would seem to be a full or nearly full lightweight tubeset regardless of tubing brand.
From what I see the workmanship quality is good whether done by an artisan builder or larger contract builder. Looks more mid '80s ('83-'86ish; pure guess of course) due to fork crown design and derailleur tab. Under the shell cable routing and bottle cage mounts were common enough in the late '70s and early '80s; but braze-on FDs and that crown style were not. The portacatena drop-out design would not really be seen much until '79-'80 model years (including some frames made in '78 for the '79 model year), and were still available in 1983 (late '82 catalog still shows the part). Possibly due to Campagnolo's success in making a part nobody wanted and ended up being over manufactured to the point where Campagnolo was dumping them on builders for next to nothing and/or old stock of builders being used up because I see those d-o's on bikes as late as 1986 (frames may have been made in '85) while the part was removed from catalogs by '85.
I will try checking again to see the other photos when the electromagnetic ether is more cooperative.
I could not view the final set of photos, but doubt that it would bring a builder to mind since all frame parts (e.g. Prugnat lugs) seen thus far are commonly used by many builders for many years in the '70s and '80s.
What is the seat post diameter? I am surprised to see a frame that large made with "SL" tubing. It was not really spec'd for larger frames due to more flex (I rode a 57 c-c "SL" frame and could readily flex it as a small 135 pound guy on an oversized frame), and durability for heavier riders. Some builders would use a mix of "SL" & "SP", but you would need to hear that from "the horse's mouth" as to what frames were in what area. Seat tube is best bet for at least determining if at least was an "SL" (27.2mm seat pin) gauged tube, or "SP" (27.0mm seat pin).
How did you determine it to be Columbus tubing? Other quality tubesets were out there at that time and the better lightweight sets would still take 27.2mm pins. I would certainly err towards Columbus, but without some sign (stamped tube/steerer ridges) I could not guess. It could easily be Oria tubing which had some lightweight sets comparable to Columbus; Falck would be my last guess for Italian tubesets. Given the total weight for frame and fork it would seem to be a full or nearly full lightweight tubeset regardless of tubing brand.
From what I see the workmanship quality is good whether done by an artisan builder or larger contract builder. Looks more mid '80s ('83-'86ish; pure guess of course) due to fork crown design and derailleur tab. Under the shell cable routing and bottle cage mounts were common enough in the late '70s and early '80s; but braze-on FDs and that crown style were not. The portacatena drop-out design would not really be seen much until '79-'80 model years (including some frames made in '78 for the '79 model year), and were still available in 1983 (late '82 catalog still shows the part). Possibly due to Campagnolo's success in making a part nobody wanted and ended up being over manufactured to the point where Campagnolo was dumping them on builders for next to nothing and/or old stock of builders being used up because I see those d-o's on bikes as late as 1986 (frames may have been made in '85) while the part was removed from catalogs by '85.
I will try checking again to see the other photos when the electromagnetic ether is more cooperative.
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SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
Thanks for the reply.
When you view the last set of photos you'll see the fork in detail. It has the SL steerer ridges/rifling and Columbus dove, but I did not get a photo of the dove. The steerer is also stamped with "59x60" so as you guessed the "59" on the BB is the TT length. Yes, probably early to mid 80s because the trend with Italian high end frames was moving towards aero cable routing around 85?
I can't find any examples of this type of BB shell. If you look closely the space between the ovals is larger/wider than the oval holes. With the similar 6 oval hole BB's it's usually the other way around, like on Chierici, Roto, Haden etc.
When you view the last set of photos you'll see the fork in detail. It has the SL steerer ridges/rifling and Columbus dove, but I did not get a photo of the dove. The steerer is also stamped with "59x60" so as you guessed the "59" on the BB is the TT length. Yes, probably early to mid 80s because the trend with Italian high end frames was moving towards aero cable routing around 85?
I can't find any examples of this type of BB shell. If you look closely the space between the ovals is larger/wider than the oval holes. With the similar 6 oval hole BB's it's usually the other way around, like on Chierici, Roto, Haden etc.
SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
Closest to the BB is some Biemmezeta BB's but those have oval cutout in the BB/downtube lug whereas this Santini has a round hole.
SteelNipple
Devout Dirtbag
27.2mm. I'll reweigh the frame and fork to be sure.
Last edited:
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