Old (Alu) Alloy susp/FR bikes? stronger than retro alloys?

[reanimation]

I've really gone off getting alu alloy bikes over the past year, crazy to think I was looking at buying an expensive light one last autumn. :-/ Decided against it for the fact a lot of em break, hard used ones and old XC retro jobbers, i have a Nishiki Alien frame with more cracks and crazes than an antique plate. Also after riding steel recently i have missed it.

So I still have this very early Santa Cruz Bullit suspension 'freerider' to paint service and build (been putting it off cos am too old skool for suspension )
Its 'modern' but still 6 to 10 year old.

People give these a bloody hard time jumping off houses, cliffs and all kinds of supercross style insane acrobatics, same with the tough Alu hardtails. Granted the street riders and dirt jumpers prefer steel but the freeride stuff is still out there larging it.

Are people like Santa Cruz (selling 4 figure frames) using special alloys and treatments that makes these frames almost as strong as steel? whats going on? The suspension will take stress off on one hand but add stress on the other hand.. ?

Course you can't get steel suspension bikes now can ya? they prefer (alu) alloy, so ya dont get extra flex i guess.


I don't think my SC has had as hard a life as the paint suggests, but i will be nitroing a few areas before it gets to powdercoaters for a look see...

Similarly my mate has just got a similar vintage '24Bicycles' hardcore alu frame to replace his old LeToy, Like my dr Jekyll they look bombproof with industrial design/weight but underneath it all its just alu alloy... or is it?

Comments/thoughts/debates? :?: :idea:

 

[perry]

didnt most dh bikes only take the rider to the cafe

itl be fine

those 24bicycles on the other hand :? cant remember one of them having normal construction . come on the seat tube should meet with the the bottom bracket shell not halfway along the downtube those crazy french with their disregard for triangulation . need all the gussets to make up for all the design flaws . id be afraid to ride a new one let alone one thats been propping up a park bench while the owner drinks alcopops

 

[reanimation]

Mad guess there! It is the Pornking, which was always my fave for its bizarre and pink looks! the Letoy was more street style and dare i say conventional

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But apart from the likely non use of full potential, why should these be so strong?

I'm expecting it to be OK, just very curious now about alloy.

 

[jonnyboy666]

a friend of mine ran the same bullit you have there in morzine for 3 years. he lived and worked there, was the only bike he had, and he was a nutter on a bike, new zealander called andrew durno, aka tallbeast from "head like a hole" (a mad mental band)

that bike saw some unbelievable abuse and as far as i know is still going strong several years later.

pretty bombproof.

most downhill bikes last a season in morzine which is 3 months. then they die so 3 years of abuse i think is pretty impressive.

 

[perry]

makes the bike look tiny

ive noticed the very tall are naturals at downhill

 

[hamster]

Aluminium cracks, it's part of the nature of the material. That's why aircraft have finite airframe lives etc.

There's no such thing as a perfect material - steel has (if well-engineered) a theoretically infinite life, likewise Alu bits that are really under-stressed like cranks (Toplines etc show the problems of under-engineering them in the name of weight saving.)

So sorry, your (and my) Alu frame will crack eventually, no matter how much it cost. In fact the ones to last longest will be the cheap ones which ride like washboards.

 

[perry]

yep if alloy was so amazing the fia would allow space frames and rollcages to be made from the stuff but no its seamless 4130 , cds , or t45

 

[jonnyboy666]

"makes the bike look tiny"

hence the name "tallbeast" that is a size large aswel.

 

[reanimation]

Loving Tallbeasts forks! must be lengthened, must only be 120mm anyway I'm off topic! :roll:
He looks like a big guy, I think mine is a medium and its pretty compact really specially upfront.

So generally where full suspension is concerned, it typically comes in alu alloy, and despite being well formulated and crafted and designed into a nut proof bike with will eventually fail, making them kinda 'disposable', compared to some of our old skool no bull steel frames which seemingly go on and on.

Santa Cruz (and other good brands) must have got summat right with their material/design. when I was looking at Commencal HT's there was always a story of cracked FS frames coming up.

 

[hamster]

Exactly - a well-engineered frame will last longer, but even then life isn't infinite.
It's only 10 years on that the frame builders and designers who really were on top of their craft become clear.