canties - straddle or no straddle?

[clockworkgazz]

How is the knee now neil?

I luntil about 2 years ago did not do any offroad biking but now love it.

Winter is the perfect excuse to get some fat tires on the apex and getting muddy, tis the best time for mt biking if you ask me- I was really crap to start with and can now say with pride that I am now pretty average in a colourful kind of way .

Get together with a few retro bikers (see rides section of the forum) and talk to other old codgers about bikes as well as eat some cake and ride the odd trail.

My mate has one of those diffusers and he tells me he cannot feel any difference, however is pretty convinced that his spoiler makes a big difference then again he does do track days and generally drives like a loon :roll:

 

[Neil]

How is the knee now neil?

It's actually fine, now.

I don't know whether it was big climbs, or gym that was to blame at the time. My knees seem fine, now - full squats in the gym seem to help me with knee health. Ankles, shoulders and elbows (and the odd hip twinge) could be better, though.

I'd guess my main challenge, now, would be time for off-roading. About as off-road as I get these days, is Centerparcs with the kids.

I cycle, now, locally, whenever I can, but mainly to try and cycle when I can make an excuse not to use the car.

I luntil about 2 years ago did not do any offroad biking but now love it.

I don't mean to blame off-roading - it may well be that I just avoided it back then, because it seemed to trouble me most when doing big climbs. But that could well have been symptom, not cause.

Winter is the perfect excuse to get some fat tires on the apex and getting muddy, tis the best time for mt biking if you ask me- I was really crap to start with and can now say with pride that I am now pretty average in a colourful kind of way .

My previous Apex (92 model) did get lots of off road use - and in fairness, stood up to it well. I just struggle with the free time, now, for it.

I try to juggle several hobbies / interests / pastimes, and a wife and 2 kids (3 month old, and 4 year old), and going off for a good few hours just to go off-roading isn't something I'd regularly be able to fit in, these days.

My mate has one of those diffusers and he tells me he cannot feel any difference, however is pretty convinced that his spoiler makes a big difference then again he does do track days and generally drives like a loon :roll:

I think for track days and high speed cornering you may feel a difference - assuming the car is quick enough. That said, I think it's in most peoples' heads. I'm not convinced people test or compare back to back - when you've got one, or recently bought / added one, you have psychological interest in realising a benefit.

When I removed the spoiler from my medium-to-large salooon (simply because I don't think bigger saloons suit a bit of plastic clamped to the boot, I think it looks cleaner at the back without it) I paid a lot of attention to a motorway sweeping bend that I drive daily, at around 70-ish. And I couldn't detect any loss of grip or stability when I'd removed it.

Now bearing in mind the speeds that aero devices start to make sense, and cornering speeds (at least on road, and probably on-track for most cars) I'm suspect most people just have this view that it should give them grip.

Maybe high-speed stability (say at autobahn speeds) is of benefit for some cars. But the opportunity for this to be of benefit must surely be truly minimal.

Let's face it, road cars have spoilers because the people who sell them, know that people want them. And people tend to want them because of how they look, or possibly in some cases of how they perceive they will peform, as opposed to how they really perform (not that I'm suggesting there's anything wrong with that).

 

[legrandefromage]

No bling on a bike? Are you weird?




anodizing simply helped raw aluminium from corroding over time - coulours were added 'cos the manufacturers could.

My Mercedes 500 SEC AMG benefitted from its front spoiler simply because the front would try and lift off at 145mph.

On private raods, of course...


Straddle cable types simply depend on when your bike was originally specced - pre 1990 -ish was a hook thingy, then came the other designs.

 

[Neil]

No bling on a bike? Are you weird?

Must be ;-)

My Mercedes 500 SEC AMG benefitted from its front spoiler simply because the front would try and lift off at 145mph.

Front spoilers are slightly different, though - that's trying to reduced the air pressure and flow of air underneath the car, which would cause lift.

And in anything fast enough, driven fast enough, you may well see improved stability from various aero at high speed.

That's very much removed from the type of tat you see bolted to most cars, though. Most of them don't go fast enough, nor could go fast enough to benefit from them.

And in fairness, all other things being equal, downforce (which is what we're talking about for things bolted to the back and on top of the car) is of main benefit (from a sporting perspective) for increasing cornering speed.

If it's there to counter lift or improve stablity, then there's some balance issues ;-)

On private raods, of course...

Naturally - either that, disused runways, or the autobahns, I've heard it all before... ;-)

Straddle cable types simply depend on when your bike was originally specced - pre 1990 -ish was a hook thingy, then came the other designs.

As to the whys, I was just commenting on the reasons (claimed) or otherwise, for why they changed from simple loops and hook-type hangers, to the link wires.

 

[clockworkgazz]

I know what you mean- trying to fit some biking in, round a busy life and family (I have 3 boys 7 months,3 and 6) ment I had to pretty much give up all my other interests to feel good spending a few hours a week away from kith and kin, however I have to say those few hours set me up for the week and are something I look forward to.

When I am out biking I become the person I was, before life swept me down the road I now travel. I think that's why this site is so good, it reminds me of a younger and sometimes more optomistic fella that I once was, that and the fact you can get red hope gear very cheap

 

[legrandefromage]

...and the fact you can get red hope gear very cheap

Red???? Surely you mean blue??

 

[Neil]

I know what you mean- trying to fit some biking in, round a busy life and family (I have 3 boys 7 months,3 and 6) ment I had to pretty much give up all my other interests to feel good spending a few hours a week away from kith and kin, however I have to say those few hours set me up for the week and are something I look forward to.

When I am out biking I become the person I was, before life swept me down the road I now travel. I think that's why this site is so good, it reminds me of a younger and sometimes more optomistic fella that I once was, that and the fact you can get red hope gear very cheap

Personally, it's nostalgic, for me. I got interested in mountain biking in the very late 80s, and was active in terms of off-road riding in the early 90s - not competively, just as an enthusiast. I did love it, although not for the mud ;-)

I think the retro thing strikes a chord with me, because I appreciated the skill of riding rigid bikes on gnarly tracks - not necessarily the boulder strewn downhills that FS bikes seem to be used on, these days. I think it was the time of the rigid bikes that was the best time, for me.

Being realistic, these days, I suspect I'll be mainly just pootling around locally, and at Centerparcs for the next few years. And when I've got more time, in years to come, I don't know - maybe I will venture off-road again. The sport / pastime, seems to have moved on, though, from the times when I really enjoyed off-roading.

 

[Old Ned]

2. Because cantis were now being used on mountain bikes, with gert knobbly tires, and on occasion, brake cables fail, if that happened, there was the possiblity of a normal straddle wire falling on to the tyre, and causing instant wheel lockup.

I had a mate whose front brake cable snapped going down a steep road hill locally and the straddle wire jammed into the tyre tread. He ended up sliding down the road on the side of his head and ripped his ear off. This did little to improve his appearance. Ever since I've always had something (such as the reflector bracket) under the cable just in case.

Regarding car spoilers, I used to refer to the one on the boot lid of my Pug 405 SRI as a 'carrying handle'. Purely decorative as most of them are.

 

[cherrybomb]

I was always lead to believe that spoilers (as opposed to gert huge wings) served two purposes (if they serve any at all).

They help keep the rear window clear on hatchbacks and other vehicles with flatter backs and reduced the size of the low pressure area that clings to the rear of a vehicle as it pushes through the air(and attracts the dirt to the previously mentioned windows) thus reducing drag.

But it sounds sexier to say they create downforce.

 

[Neil]

I was always lead to believe that spoilers (as opposed to gert huge wings) served two purposes (if they serve any at all).

They help keep the rear window clear on hatchbacks and other vehicles with flatter backs and reduced the size of the low pressure area that clings to the rear of a vehicle as it pushes through the air(and attracts the dirt to the previously mentioned windows) thus reducing drag.

But it sounds sexier to say they create downforce.

The reason they are on most cars, is simply marketting - we can try and find reasons and excuses, but at the end of the day, it's because many people like stick on tat on their cars.

If they had a valid purpose, they wouldn't be included in options packs intended to appeal to a certain demographic.

As to what they really do, look at the angle of attack. As to drag, if it interrupts the air-flow over the car, it ADDS drag. Even if it tidies up airflow at the back of the car, it still adds drag.

Don't try and find some complex reason for why they exist on the majority of cars - there isn't any particular, objective reason - think Occam's razor. The reason is very simple - because people want them for looks. People involved in the marketing of cars know what lights peoples' candles. So they play to their audience.

All you have to consider, is this - diffusers on Clios ;-)