Gun Control

[lumos2000]

B77 said----"In fact California was top of the table you must be so proud."----Look, anybody who is proud of someone being killed is a total idiot and a sociopath-It seems to me that you are pretty proud of yourself in your smugness and self righteous back patting with your statistics...

Don't worry Pat had this problem with B77 before self righteous douche bag that he is on a high horse. I mentioned i go hunting and that made me a cruel Bar Steward by all accounts

+1 :roll:

 

[cannondale king]

B77 said----"In fact California was top of the table you must be so proud."----Look, anybody who is proud of someone being killed is a total idiot and a sociopath-It seems to me that you are pretty proud of yourself in your smugness and self righteous back patting with your statistics...

Don't worry Pat had this problem with B77 before self righteous douche bag that he is on a high horse. I mentioned i go hunting and that made me a cruel Bar Steward by all accounts

+1 :roll:

Cheers fella you know what i mean "your opions wrong unless it's the same as mine!" in this day an age when people should be more easy going towards each other you get people like this.

As too the thread the uk holds some of the tightest gun laws in the world and getting a fire arms licence is really hard i think they should add a full pychological profile test but other than that thats it remeber its not the gun that kills but the person behind it the same as cars

 

[JeRkY]

I like to think that any one has a right to an opinion. And if that opinion is that guns are [beavis] he, cool[\butthead] then fine, but B77 has presented reasonable statistics and asked direct questions that have been met with little to counter argue them that don't in a roundabout way strengthen his point.

Ck, no offence but backing one blind argument as a form to criticise another isn't clever. And will people stop making the frankly rediculous comparisons between guns and cars (read back for reasoning). I supposeultimately you are right, guns don't kill people, much like the bombs dropped on Hiroshima didn't kill people, but they made it ******* easy to.

Any way, I'm off to California with my girlfriend next week, please don't shoot me for not agreeing with you.

 

[B77]

B77 said----"In fact California was top of the table you must be so proud."----Look, anybody who is proud of someone being killed is a total idiot and a sociopath-It seems to me that you are pretty proud of yourself in your smugness and self righteous back patting with your statistics...

Don't worry Pat had this problem with B77 before self righteous douche bag that he is on a high horse. I mentioned i go hunting and that made me a cruel Bar Steward by all accounts

Hang on, what I said was as far as I'm concerned hunting for sport and not for food is cruel and unecessary. If you hunt simply for the joy of killing (forget all thos 'pest control' crap) then yes you do have a cruel streak

And yes I am self righteous, so what ? Is standing up for what you believe a character flaw ?

Anyway what are your views on gun control in the US Cannondale King and Lumos ? Or did you both just come here to have a pop ? If so fire away

 

[FairfaxPat]

"And yes I am self righteous" ----------

 

[sylus]

I am anti american foreign policy.

Every reasonable person is. Maybe a good topic for our next argument?

Bram..I can absolutely assure you most brits are stronger in their opinion of what comes out of brussels than what comes out of the u.s. how is belgium by the way?

B77, cheers to you for your indefatigability (is this an actual word?).
gerryattrick, cheers to you for your sensible posts

and for the rest of you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPfeTBwrGAw

I was dissapointed with this bram

The discussion largely has been informative from both sides and allowing a discussion into another country..for most of you..rights and standards..something most of you continually moan about your own governments doing but you do nothing about..but when those in the u.s. rights are challenged they try and put forward a reasoned argument based on actual facts rather than wikipedia quotes..that does seem to have provoked those who feel being in another country with wikipedia qoutes is sufficient to be informed

The bit that annoyed me the most bram about your post..it's clear your anti american and not policy as you try and hide behind, but the discussion was about gun control following the murder of children..and from that you felt "f*ck the americans" videos was a reinforcement of your "intelligent input"

This sir, was possibly the most offensive thing within this thread given we are trying to move forward if there was an ignore button I would use it as saying your claiming the moral high ground thinking of americans dying ..whilst posting f*ck the american videos is contradictory and offensive

Cannondale king..thank you for being open minded and not limited by those with stereotypes as the only information avaliable it's refereshing certianly within this discussion

Jerky.. most of b77's "facts" were wikipedia and one state facts and not the entire country, surely then to label an entire country based on incorrect facts is not so admirable...it's just an attack using in ignorant, uninformed and anti us stance whilst trying..and failing to hide it as genuine concern

The comparisons are genuine, for example..in countries such as britian gun control is not so much the issue, but...death by mental health, alcoholism, suicide and drugs is massivley on the increase but very little is done to combat this because it's easier to say...if it means change..nahhh forget it something they say others are guilty of.

I'll post a reasonably balanaced clip by facts short vid from live leak

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=9a0_1356034600

lastly

And yes I am self righteous, so what ? Is standing up for what you believe a character flaw

and yet when others do you you proclaim them as incorrect and only you can be correct

B77... that single sentence there shows that you care not for the children as you claim, you just want to be the person who is right on the internet and on that basis sir, those of us who are actually trying to find a resolution that can save more lives in the country we live in...find your input based on hate rather than resolution rather less than honest

 

[JeRkY]

Pat your argument is increasingly looking more personal than supportive and certainly off the topic of this thread/debate.

I don't think any one is criticising the country as a whole or you as a person, just keeping to the topic of questioning attitudes toward fire arms.

 

[sylus]

Pat your argument is increasingly looking more personal than supportive and certainly off the topic of this thread/debate.

I don't think any one is criticising the country as a whole or you as a person, just keeping to the topic of questioning attitudes toward fire arms.

not so jerky, honestly read through the thread, bram and b77 have consistently been anti american as the posting of "f*ck the americans" video shows..whilst at the same time they care for the american people..i can spot this a mile off and I'm a brit

 

[FairfaxPat]

"I don't think any one is criticising the country as a whole "---what about the video from Bram? That certainly is just about criticizing the U.S.

 

[Bram J]

in this day an age when people should be more easy going towards each other

That's the sixties you're talking about right there.
IMO people are overly sensitive, almost all of the time. They can't handle people with opinions that are not part of the public opinion or the mainstream and will resort to name-calling rapidly. Try to voice your opinion in an environment where you're the only one upholding that particular opinion. You will be handled with ridicule and name-calling, not with logic, no matter what your opinion exactly is. If you persist, it is likely that you have to face violence too. You don't conform, you get beaten down. That's simply humanity for you.
What really sucks about this is that these people who always hold the mainstream opinion are not helping human progress and stop us from moving forward by protecting the 'status quo'.

Galileo Galilei was right about his Heliocentrism, yet he was ridiculed and even banned by the church.
Hitler was obviously wrong and straight out wicked, yet he was the most loved politician Germany had and has ever seen.

Maybe it's time to convert the hysterical uneducated masses into the unhysterical educated masses. I don't think it will ever happen though.

Mark Twain had a great quote: "It's easier to fool the people than it is to convince them that they have been fooled".

From the movie twelve monkeys: "There's no right, there's no wrong; there's only popular opinion". Galileo Galilei was considered to be wrong in his day, while Hitler was considered to be right.

As too the thread the uk holds some of the tightest gun laws in the world and getting a fire arms licence is really hard i think they should add a full pychological profile test but other than that thats it remeber its not the gun that kills but the person behind it the same as cars

I agree a psychological test might be useful. Of course this will not keep people who are initially stable but who become depressed, unstable or psychotic over time from possessing firearms. Maybe a test every five years or so? I don't know if this is practically possible, or what the costs of this will be though.

Now back on topic, the gun-laws in Europe are better than the gun-laws in the USA, this is fact. If you don't think so, just look at some numbers. And don't go all like ''numbers are easily misinterpreted" and such. Look at the numbers and tell me how these could be misinterpreted. People die all around the world because of people who don't believe in numbers, don't be silly about it. You want less dead kids? Take our advice and make your gun-laws stricter. Do you have to copy the 'European' model? No. Can you take lessons from it? Yes.
Anyone who takes himself seriously would have to say that the USA has a gun-problem. Anyway, things have to happen, I think we all agree on that one.