Choosing a frame for drop bar / gravel bike conversion

[Captain Stupido]

Nowt wrong with 501 but 531 is double butted, seamless and thinner walled as it was reasonably exotic. I'm pretty sure that 501 was main tubes only too, no stays either. The Raleigh frames in 501 used fairly plain att23 rear triangles. The 531 frames feel a bit nicer.to ride, a bit more lively well does anyway, almost up there with prestige.
Carl

531 isn't always butted, and it was often supplied in a thicker gauge for "ATB" construction. My Ozark was a heavy lump, presumably plain gauge, and definitely not the thin-walled stuff. Some tubesets were main tubes only, too. It is a lighter steel alloy though, being manganese/molybdenum as opposed to the "normal" cro-mo of 501. On the plus side, 501 is generally butted (500 being the plain gauge equivalent).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_Technology

In terms of "liveliness" it varies. Obviously some of it comes down to the way the frame (and the rider) is built. I've had more lively 501 frames than 531 ones, but I wouldn't want to generalise (or push up the price of 501 frames).

You're right that the higher-end models in a given range tended to be 531 rather than 501, but there are some bargains out there in the lesser Reynolds tube sets, and what you save on the frame you can spend on the other bits. Personally, if money were an object, I'd rather have a 501 frame and posher components than the other way round.

 

[xxnick1975]

Appreciate it’s not the gist of this thread, but modern gravel bikes are actually decent, and in many ways the modern equivalent of a retro rigid mtb

 

[drcarlos]

Nowt wrong with 501 but 531 is double butted, seamless and thinner walled as it was reasonably exotic. I'm pretty sure that 501 was main tubes only too, no stays either. The Raleigh frames in 501 used fairly plain att23 rear triangles. The 531 frames feel a bit nicer.to ride, a bit more lively well does anyway, almost up there with prestige.
Carl

531 isn't always butted, and it was often supplied in a thicker gauge for "ATB" construction. My Ozark was a heavy lump, presumably plain gauge, and definitely not the thin-walled stuff. Some tubesets were main tubes only, too. It is a lighter steel alloy though, being manganese/molybdenum as opposed to the "normal" cro-mo of 501. On the plus side, 501 is generally butted (500 being the plain gauge equivalent).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_Technology

In terms of "liveliness" it varies. Obviously some of it comes down to the way the frame (and the rider) is built. I've had more lively 501 frames than 531 ones, but I wouldn't want to generalise (or push up the price of 501 frames).

It does look like 501/531 ATB shared stays though, so some makers would have built a frame with full 501 ATB including stays.

You're right that the higher-end models in a given range tended to be 531 rather than 501, but there are some bargains out there in the lesser Reynolds tube sets, and what you save on the frame you can spend on the other bits. Personally, if money were an object, I'd rather have a 501 frame and posher components than the other way round.

Wikipedia isn't always the best to go for for information, some is incorrect or is lost as it appears to be in this case.

Fortunately the original paperwork from Reynolds still exists and can be found with a bit of digging.

Here's the original Reynolds constructors guide for tubes.

https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=32762

As you can see 531 is always butted (at least single, more often double and sometimes triple). 501 is sometimes not butted at all, but sometimes double butted and sometimes single.

I have the Raleigh 531 team in 531 which shares the same tubeset as the Ozark (in fact it was a copy of the Thunderroad just in another colour which replaced the Ozark in 198. This is the 531 ATB tubeset (just checked to confirm). Later on came 531 Magnum which was a larger diameter.

Like I said nowt wrong with 501 but 531 is a better tube and being a a high grade alloy and seamless it allows the thinner gauge and the more extreme butting profiles.

Carl.

 

[Captain Stupido]

Nowt wrong with 501 but 531 is double butted, seamless and thinner walled as it was reasonably exotic. I'm pretty sure that 501 was main tubes only too, no stays either. The Raleigh frames in 501 used fairly plain att23 rear triangles. The 531 frames feel a bit nicer.to ride, a bit more lively well does anyway, almost up there with prestige.
Carl

531 isn't always butted, and it was often supplied in a thicker gauge for "ATB" construction. My Ozark was a heavy lump, presumably plain gauge, and definitely not the thin-walled stuff. Some tubesets were main tubes only, too. It is a lighter steel alloy though, being manganese/molybdenum as opposed to the "normal" cro-mo of 501. On the plus side, 501 is generally butted (500 being the plain gauge equivalent).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_Technology

In terms of "liveliness" it varies. Obviously some of it comes down to the way the frame (and the rider) is built. I've had more lively 501 frames than 531 ones, but I wouldn't want to generalise (or push up the price of 501 frames).

It does look like 501/531 ATB shared stays though, so some makers would have built a frame with full 501 ATB including stays.

You're right that the higher-end models in a given range tended to be 531 rather than 501, but there are some bargains out there in the lesser Reynolds tube sets, and what you save on the frame you can spend on the other bits. Personally, if money were an object, I'd rather have a 501 frame and posher components than the other way round.

Wikipedia isn't always the best to go for for information, some is incorrect or is lost as it appears to be in this case.

Fortunately the original paperwork from Reynolds still exists and can be found with a bit of digging.

Here's the original Reynolds constructors guide for tubes.

https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=32762

As you can see 531 is always butted (at least single, more often double and sometimes triple). 501 is sometimes not butted at all, but sometimes double butted and sometimes single.

I have the Raleigh 531 team in 531 which shares the same tubeset as the Ozark (in fact it was a copy of the Thunderroad just in another colour which replaced the Ozark in 198. This is the 531 ATB tubeset (just checked to confirm). Later on came 531 Magnum which was a larger diameter.

Like I said nowt wrong with 501 but 531 is a better tube and being a a high grade alloy and seamless it allows the thinner gauge and the more extreme butting profiles.

Carl.

Thanks, that's an interesting link. Further down the thread though someone points out out that in the past Reynolds DID supply plain gauge 531, although it's not mentioned in that Reynolds scan. Presumably at the time of that document it wasn't being made. As I understand it the exact specs of the range has varied over the years which is probably part of the reason why the Wikipedia entry is a bit vague.

Seems I stand corrected on the 531ATB tube set, as if memory serves, the Ozark used that, and the link does indicate that it's double butted and thin walled. Weird that the bike used an unusual seatpost diameter...

I stand by my assertion that it was a heavy lump and nothing special to ride. The (501) Yukon was nicer.

 

[hamster]

Having built a drop bar MTB in 1995 and ridden it on 4 continents as a do-anything tourer ever since, some guidelines:
1 Go early-90s; later frames got too long in the top tube and then too high at the front for long-travel forks.
2 Lower-end frames are shorter than race-orientated (e.g. Specialized Hard Rock/Rockhopper not Stumpjumper, Marin Palisades/ not Eldridge or Pine Mtn) and therefore better suited to the closer steerer that drop bars need. Konas are almost impossible to convert!
3 You will probably need a taller bar setup, (short stem with rise) likewise short reach & shallow drop bars (say 130mm) or the woodchipper / One-One Midge type.
4 Avoid discs as everything will get complicated. Use V's with Tektro CR720 levers,
but you will need inline cable adjusters.
5 Gears are best solved with bar-end levers.

 

[Smithjss70]

Some great advice in this thread! As a taller rider (6'1"), I went with the geometry of a 95' Ala Carte but in a slightly smaller frame than normal along with a Salsa P10 stem that puts me more out over the TT and bar. For my riding preference and general topography, this setup suits me well, is comfortable and I feel pretty confident as I'm still a beginner with MTB droppers having only a couple years under the belt.

Here is my setup along with some info I received along the way. It's a great riding experience, unique and fun way to enjoy a vintage MTB! Good luck! viewtopic.php?f=6&t=359774

 

[drcarlos]

Annoyingly this has got me thinking that I have a 1991 Muddyfox Sorcerer Mega in the Loft doing nothing (I was going to sell it but never got around to it) and I could create a good gravel bike from this startpoint.

Damn you Retrobike!

Carl.

 

[legrandefromage]

This was fun

and purple

And from an even longerer time ago

But I might just make a new one too!

 

[legrandefromage]

Oh and:

 

[The History Man]

That’s the one with the dodgy dropout spacing.