Bernard Carre frame - What specification am I working to?

NGR

Retro Newbie
Hi, picked this frame up for a Winter build project.

It's a Bernard Carre frame and despite the paint being very rough, the frame and forks look sound.

I'm not looking to undertake a full Bernard Carre restoration, rather, I'd get the frame re-sprayed and build it up with approx. period parts and make it a single-speed. I've found a few articles on the 'Net on Bernard Carre, but specifications are light.

Would I be looking for 27" or 700c rims? Deep drop brakes or short? I think the BB and headset will be French (35 x 1), but don't know for sure just yet.

I've found a couple of B. Carre posts on here, so will have a read.
 

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bertinjim

Dirt Disciple
Hi, NGR-

Your Carre looks like one of his personal production framesets rather than a Lejeune, Delacroix, Bertin or whatever. The engraved stay caps, diamond lug cut outs and the modified fork crown indicate a Carre branded frame. It looks to be early to mid 1970s so Normandy Competition hubs with 700C tubulars, Stronglight V4 or P3 headset and Stronglight 49 or 93 crankset would be appropriate. Brakes might be Mafac Competition CP or, possibly, 1st Gen Mafac LS sidepulls of normal reach (about 55 mm to the center of the pad at the rim). This was a higher end frame so these components might be typical but much of his production was sold as framesets so be flexible re: equipment specifications.

The threading will be very likely all French in both BB and headset. Seat post will probably be 26.4 mm. The tubeset is likely to be French 531. There is a series on a Carre Bertin restoration here: https://bertinclassiccycles.wordpress.com/restoration/

There's a 3 part series about Carre here: https://bertinclassiccycles.wordpress.com/2016/02/29/bernard-carre-and-andre-bertin/

If you need decals for the respray, reproductions are available here: https://bicycledecals.net/collections/bernard-carre

Hope this helps.
 

NGR

Retro Newbie
Hey, many thanks gents. Very much appreciated.

I was just looking for a cheap frame to move a load of late '70s kit onto (including Normandy hubs), but it was never going to be that straightforward was it ;) This project will take me a bit longer than I originally thought.

The bottom bracket shell and forks are numbered, "072" and "H82". If "early to mid-seventies", then "072" could be 1972(?). As for "H82", I cannot locate any reference to that on the 'Net.

I attach further pictures I have of the frame for interest. (Never seen a fork steerer "plugged" before.

Many thanks again all.
 

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NGR

Retro Newbie
Hi, yep I think I owe you 50p. I don't have too many spare bottom brackets and I had assumed this would be a French thread for the BB. Looks like your steer toward "BSA" is correct.

The cups I removed from an alleged Claud Butler I had , had a Bayliss Wiley cup on the LH side (other than name, no thread detail) and it fitted fine on the LH side. The RH cup was a 1.37 x 24 Tange cup, which doesn't want to fit on the Carre frame. However, having had a Brompton for eons, and kept all the parts I'd replaced, I had a BSA bottom bracket from that. Just for testing, it worked fine on the RH side.

Thanks for the steer on this.
 
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