A final try at identifying my mystery bike

[Jesper]

@glenfield2 most oval tubes at their centers are pretty obvious to see in person; sometimes hard to see in a photo. A cheap micrometer will easily show the difference as we are not talking tenths of mm's; but instead many mm's difference from thin section to wide section.

Also, builders manipulated round tubing post factory so any frame regardless of tubing brand might be either ovalized or crimped in some manner for performance (stiffer frame) and/or aesthetics.

 

[juvela]

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mention made above of Japan producing copies of european lug designs

here is a Tange catalogue page showing their replica of the Prugnat model 62/d lug -




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[glenfield2]

In a final, final attempt to identify this bike - only clue Tange stamped bottom bracket and some very basic numbering- anyone fancy trying to decipher these markings on the fork steerer?

 

[juvela]

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perchance our framebuilder member @bulgie may see something here...


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[bulgie]

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perchance our framebuilder member @bulgie may see something here...


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I got nothin'. I would assume Japanese-built though.

 

[juvela]

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wonder if steerer "markings" may not have been done intentionally but due to something inside the clamp which was used to hold the tube during construction...


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[glenfield2]

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wonder if steerer "markings" may not have been done intentionally but due to something inside the clamp which was used to hold the tube during construction...


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I couldn’t decide whether it was Egyptian hieroglyphics or Sanskrit. Unintelligible to me.

 

[non-fixie]

What is the actual BB threading?

If BSC, then I suspect this frame was made in Belgium. Belgian builders were known to use Japanese tubing and frame parts. Frames were often delivered as "blank" frames, i.e. painted but without a serial number or branding. The client, usually a bike shop, would add their own decals, a serial number (sometimes), and build up the bike with their choice of parts.

Most bike shops didn't bother with serial numbers, but when they did they tend to look like this:



I don't think it is an Asian frame, certainly not from a large manufacturer, as their serial numbers are generally easily recognizable as such. Neatly stamped in a typical font, such as on this (Koga-)Miyata BB shell:

 

[glenfield2]

What is the actual BB threading?

If BSC, then I suspect this frame was made in Belgium. Belgian builders were known to use Japanese tubing and frame parts. Frames were often delivered as "blank" frames, i.e. painted but without a serial number or branding. The client, usually a bike shop, would add their own decals, a serial number (sometimes), and build up the bike with their choice of parts.

Most bike shops didn't bother with serial numbers, but when they did they tend to look like this:

View attachment 984953

I don't think it is an Asian frame, certainly not from a large manufacturer, as their serial numbers are generally easily recognizable as such. Neatly stamped in a typical font, such as on this (Koga-)Miyata BB shell:

View attachment 984960

You could well be right. It’s BSC threading. I have a frame with TANGE bottom bracket, Campag fork ends, randomly applied frame numbering and a deceased owner so I guess we will never really be certain.
Sadly, it’s too big for me and as a nameless and rather scruffy late ‘80s frame is of little value either.

 

[Canuk]

Our LBS imported hundreds of these Belgian frames, most of which went down the winter bike rabbit hole and quietly rusted away under pretty poor two tone fade paint finishes.

As far as I remember they were all Falck (Italian) tubing, which was pretty heavy, around 531 weight or heavier and mine definitely had no serial numbers. I'm pretty sure he sold them on to other bike shops in the area as you would often see them in bike jumbles with dodgy decals etc.

Certainly not the worst frames ever made, but the paint and the weight were both issues and like I said most people bought them to thrash through salt laden winters. This certainly had the look of one, especially with the BSC bracket.