'97 Marin Pine Mountain....
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There are specs in Bikepedia. The Team Marin and Team Issue both had Tange Prestige (i.e., heat-treated) frames. The Muirwoods, Bear Valley, Eldridge Grade and Pine Mountain had double-butted generic cromo frames, i.e., not heat-treated, i.e., slightly heavier for the same strength.
Anthony":3sx5lwwb said:
Cheers Anthony...yeah i seen Bikepedia mention double butted (hense me confusion) though me oppo's just kopped for a frame with what looks to be very original decals and the seat-tube decal definately states triple-butted cromo with the rear seat stays claiming quad butted :?
It's the stunt double (colour/decal style) to Steve kish's in this thread..
http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=93004
Some of this is just ad man speak. If you have a tube with a butt at each end, I would call that double-butted, but I think there are some who would call a 0.9-0.6-0.8 tube triple-butted because there are three different thicknesses in play, whereas a 0.9-0.6-0.9 tube only has two thicknesses. The difference between the two just comes down to how much stiffness the designer wanted at a particular joint. I think calling it triple-butted rather than double-butted can be a bit misleading.
I've never seen a spec for a multi-thickness steel tube for stays, so I can't say for sure what Marin were getting at there. But as an example from aluminium, Easton used to make a '19 x 1.4-1.8-1.3-1.4t' seat stay for Elite tubesets. I would guess the 1.8 bit was to provide additional stiffness around the brake bosses and nothing to do with compliance or ride quality. I think they would call that quad-butting, but again without really explaining what the quad butting was for.
With stays, you've also got to bear in mind tapering and shaping, which also can give you more sophisticated effects even without any butting at all - e.g., as far as I am aware, Tange always used plain gauge stays right up to the Prestige Ultimate tubesets, but they used tapering and shaping instead.
With stays, you've also got to bear in mind tapering and shaping, which also can give you more sophisticated effects even without any butting at all - e.g., as far as I am aware, Tange always used plain gauge stays right up to the Prestige Ultimate tubesets, but they used tapering and shaping instead.
That's surprisingly light. I'm always slightly wary of Marin sizes, because I think they actually sized on a c-c basis, but I have a note here of a size 19 (c-t basis) 1993 Team Marin (Tange Prestige Ultimate Superlight) and that weighed 4.33lbs.
Even within a given grade of tubing, there is still scope for the designer to go for heavier or lighter depending on how stiff/strong that particular model needed to be. Sometimes race bikes needed to be heavier in some respects because they needed to be stiffer than a leisure bike. But the marketing department would never let on about it!
Even within a given grade of tubing, there is still scope for the designer to go for heavier or lighter depending on how stiff/strong that particular model needed to be. Sometimes race bikes needed to be heavier in some respects because they needed to be stiffer than a leisure bike. But the marketing department would never let on about it!
