1989 Claud Butler Pagan. Gravelly Rebuild?

oaklec

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Oaklec reporting in for duty.

Thought of the day, you could strip the giant of most things and fit them to the claud to see if it gives you the bike you are looking for. Then when you are finished experimenting you could get the frame painted.

Regarding wheel spacing, the front will be fine, the rear will need the rear stays prising apart (think old fashioned bullworker advert) before slotting the wheel in. Looks like the giant crank is lower geared than the claud.

Which brakes and shifters are on the giant?
 

Jaffa

Dirt Disciple
That's a thought but its already with the finishers. Although I can nick components of that Giant. The Shifter/Lever is a combined unit, Shimano ST-EF51-AL fairly nasty and the clear plastic covers are horribly yellowed:

20210602_210251.jpg

My frame and forks have canti bosses, which provides the better ultimate performance? Canti or V Brakes and are they interchangeable?

Happy to spend some cash on decent used brakes, shifters and derailleurs if I can get an elegant, functional and reliable solution.

The Giants brakes are Tektro generic V brakes, The Pagan had Exage Country throughout (Cantis.)
The Exage Country chainset is 48/38/28 Biopace and M250 170mm cranks.
The Suntour one is 44/34/24 with 170mm cranks. It weighs 224 g less than the original.

Cheers.

Dave
 

oaklec

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V brakes will fit the Claud frame just fine and will out perform the cantis you have.

However, if you are looking for an elegant solution, cantis are the way forward.
 

Jaffa

Dirt Disciple
Oh ok I didnt realise V brakes were better, engineering wise they look shite, cludged together to make wheel removal a touch easier.

Looks like Cantis have more mechanical leverage but maybe not then. They are a much cleaner solution for sure.

So what do I need to do look for an x Speed specific set of triggershifters and how much leeway have I got with number of gears? Are cranksets speed specific? Eg 8spd 9spd etc?

Cheers,

Dave
 

oaklec

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7, 8 and 9 speeds generally work ok with the same mechs and cranks. Some 9 speed front mechs are a bit fussy if a 7 or 8 speed chain is a bit wide, it will rub at the extremes. Cranksets are generally ok to mix and match across those speeds.

Question, do you want more gears or just a wider range of gears? Shifters can be quite expensive, so if it's just a wider range of gears maybe find some shifters you like and then get the other parts to suit.

There is no reason not to reuse your existing crank, though if you want to change the rings out so they are not biopace, it may be cheaper to pick up a new square taper crank from spa cycles.
 

Jaffa

Dirt Disciple
Hiya,

I want lower gears. The 8 speed cassette on the Giant wheels has a 34T large sprocket and the Chainset has a 24T small ring. Pretty low gearing to be fair but if I can go lower I gladly will.

Would like some decent separate shifters and brake levers. So shifters need to be speed specific and brake levers need to be type specific?

To be frank the Exage cranks are scratched and gouged and I'm aiming for an all black fit out so if the Suntour cranks and rings fit I'll use them to get the black aesthetic, 24T gear and save 266 g of weight. What defines the axle width required for a particular crankset?
 

oaklec

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Hiya,

I want lower gears. The 8 speed cassette on the Giant wheels has a 34T large sprocket and the Chainset has a 24T small ring. Pretty low gearing to be fair but if I can go lower I gladly will.

Would like some decent separate shifters and brake levers. So shifters need to be speed specific and brake levers need to be type specific?

To be frank the Exage cranks are scratched and gouged and I'm aiming for an all black fit out so if the Suntour cranks and rings fit I'll use them to get the black aesthetic, 24T gear and save 266 g of weight. What defines the axle width required for a particular crankset?
Yes shifters need to be speed specific and generally brake levers need to be type specific. There used to be levers that would work with both canti and v because they had a kind of built in toggle to change the cable pull. Not sure they are still readily available anymore.

The shape of the crank arms usually dictates axle length, too short and the arms will foul on the chain stays but also the size of the inner chain ring plays a part, it also needs clearance from the chain stay.

That's my retrobike shift over... time for bed
 

Jaffa

Dirt Disciple
Thanks. I appreciate everyones answers.
Off to research, levers and shifters.

Cheers

Dave
 

oaklec

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Just one more thing, you might struggle to find an all black elegant 5 arm crankset with 22, 32, 42 chainrings as they tended to be silver with a black outer ring, such as a XT FC-M737
 
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