Suntour Microdrive cassette question
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That bottom is a 12T so a 'normal' pre Microdrive setup (not that there is much difference in getting them off)
You use the 'good old technique'.Brute force and chainwhips.
I'll see if I can find instructions rather than typing it out
(short of it is
two chain whips*
one on larger cogs to hold it in place, one on smallest cog.
turn smallest to unscrew off the hub body. )
*as you may find, they can be a bugger to get off. I still have one that rock solid after a lot of trying.
It may be beter to clamp the small cog in a vice somehow, one such (from sheldon brown site) is
EDIT here's the first video I found showing the Shimano Uniglide removal (same principle, just much easier to find results for)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2-1ZdHww5g
if it is that easy, you're the luckiest bugger alive.
You use the 'good old technique'.Brute force and chainwhips.
I'll see if I can find instructions rather than typing it out
(short of it is
two chain whips*
one on larger cogs to hold it in place, one on smallest cog.
turn smallest to unscrew off the hub body. )
*as you may find, they can be a bugger to get off. I still have one that rock solid after a lot of trying.
It may be beter to clamp the small cog in a vice somehow, one such (from sheldon brown site) is
EDIT here's the first video I found showing the Shimano Uniglide removal (same principle, just much easier to find results for)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2-1ZdHww5g
if it is that easy, you're the luckiest bugger alive.
guybagnall
Dirt Disciple
Re: Re:
Hi - Could you possibly help with a similar question for a Suntour GPX?
The '89 catalogue shows only 1 - 126mm OLD, I have a 7 speed hub in poor condition and found a 6 speed hub at 126mm - would the spline length be the same for the two - I read the 7th cog was attached to the 6th - and would there be an adjustment required to use the 6-speed - or is the spline different lengths as with the posher version?
Is it possible to use the 6 speed or only a 7 speed - or (forgive the ignorant question) would it be possible to remove the spline from the tatty seven speed and put it on the new 6 speed hub?
Regards
Corduroyboy":isxqcgaj said:
Hi - Could you possibly help with a similar question for a Suntour GPX?
The '89 catalogue shows only 1 - 126mm OLD, I have a 7 speed hub in poor condition and found a 6 speed hub at 126mm - would the spline length be the same for the two - I read the 7th cog was attached to the 6th - and would there be an adjustment required to use the 6-speed - or is the spline different lengths as with the posher version?
Is it possible to use the 6 speed or only a 7 speed - or (forgive the ignorant question) would it be possible to remove the spline from the tatty seven speed and put it on the new 6 speed hub?
Regards
I suspect this reply is too old to be of use, but what you have is a New Winner threaded freewheel with a couple of broken remover tabs. Your best bet to get it off is to disassemble the body, clamp the inner part that is threaded onto the hub into a vice, and pull it off. On the other hand, if the chain isn't skipping, and you don't need to replace the bearing on the drive side or replace spokes, just ride it like it is. That's a fantastic freewheel and removing it will almost certainly destroy it (not to mention that you'll have to disassemble it again to get it off in the future). That hub has quality sealed bearings, and the GreaseGuard feature allows you to flush in new grease without disassembly.
With the cassette hubs, a significant issue is the limited choices in cassette size. This is especially a problem with MicroDrive, which requires the two smallest cogs to be the 11-12 combination that was the only option Suntour ever made. The idea was that the cassette would be combined with smaller chainrings in the front, such as 20-30-40-tooth setups, which would reduce weight and increase ground clearance, without the complexity of changing the chain pitch, as Shimano had tried to do with their 10 mm-pitch track setup in the 1970s. A 40 x 11 makes sense for top gear on a mountain bike, and, at the time at least, a 20 x 24 low gear made sense as well, and this was the ONLY option for the 7-spd MicroDrive setup. Can you imagine a 24-tooth large cog on a MTB cassette today? Those certainly were different times.
The real challenge is translating this setup to the road. I know I speak against modern thinking, and this is offset by the widespread move to compact gearing on the road, but I have no use at all for an 11-tooth cog and, given a choice, I wouldn't even bother with a 12. I would much, much rather have fewer cogs, a wider chain, and still have fairly close jumps and a wide range. The vast majority of riders would be fine with a 13, 14 or even 15 tooth small cog (yeah, Junior gears). Starting with 9-speed, the cogs started getting thinner and thinner, which reduces the surface area that the chain is bearing on the cog, increasing the load per square mm, and the resulting wear. The technical shenanigans required to compete in the "More Speeds Race" make the system more fragile, more difficult to work on, and more expensive FOR NO PRACTICAL BENEFIT when all you are doing is adding more tiny cogs. About the only thing these 11 and 12 speed cassettes have going for them in my book is the ability to totally eliminate front shifting by going to a single chainring, but I've got 50 years shifting front derailleurs under my belt and just don't have a problem with them. I will yield to the concept of single-chainring setups for off-road, but I still regularly ride a 39 x 52, 13-28 seven-speed bike with indexed downtube shifters and would happily take that bike anywhere without feeling that I was disadvantaged. That's not just being a retrogrouch--it works.
The point is that the Sutntour MicroDrive setup is a bum for the road. 8-speed non-MD is a rare beast, indeed, and I'm talking Unicorn-Rare here. Best bet is to find a non-MD, 7-speed body and retrofit it onto an 8-spd body, if you don't want to replace the entire hub. You can mill or carefully grind off the threads on the 12-tooth cog for the 11-tooth one to provide clearance.
Eventually, you can just throw the whole setup away and replace it with a suitable Shimano-compatible hub. The spacing is plenty close enough to provide excellent interchangeability. You have to match the shifters and rear derailleur, but your Suntour setup will happily shift a Shimano cassette. Ditto for freewheels, and you can get a 13-28, 7-spd Shimano freewheel for less than 20 bucks that will thread right on your beautiful, threaded Suntour hub. Couple that with a $15 chain and you have excellent shifting fro the unwashed masses.
With the cassette hubs, a significant issue is the limited choices in cassette size. This is especially a problem with MicroDrive, which requires the two smallest cogs to be the 11-12 combination that was the only option Suntour ever made. The idea was that the cassette would be combined with smaller chainrings in the front, such as 20-30-40-tooth setups, which would reduce weight and increase ground clearance, without the complexity of changing the chain pitch, as Shimano had tried to do with their 10 mm-pitch track setup in the 1970s. A 40 x 11 makes sense for top gear on a mountain bike, and, at the time at least, a 20 x 24 low gear made sense as well, and this was the ONLY option for the 7-spd MicroDrive setup. Can you imagine a 24-tooth large cog on a MTB cassette today? Those certainly were different times.
The real challenge is translating this setup to the road. I know I speak against modern thinking, and this is offset by the widespread move to compact gearing on the road, but I have no use at all for an 11-tooth cog and, given a choice, I wouldn't even bother with a 12. I would much, much rather have fewer cogs, a wider chain, and still have fairly close jumps and a wide range. The vast majority of riders would be fine with a 13, 14 or even 15 tooth small cog (yeah, Junior gears). Starting with 9-speed, the cogs started getting thinner and thinner, which reduces the surface area that the chain is bearing on the cog, increasing the load per square mm, and the resulting wear. The technical shenanigans required to compete in the "More Speeds Race" make the system more fragile, more difficult to work on, and more expensive FOR NO PRACTICAL BENEFIT when all you are doing is adding more tiny cogs. About the only thing these 11 and 12 speed cassettes have going for them in my book is the ability to totally eliminate front shifting by going to a single chainring, but I've got 50 years shifting front derailleurs under my belt and just don't have a problem with them. I will yield to the concept of single-chainring setups for off-road, but I still regularly ride a 39 x 52, 13-28 seven-speed bike with indexed downtube shifters and would happily take that bike anywhere without feeling that I was disadvantaged. That's not just being a retrogrouch--it works.
The point is that the Sutntour MicroDrive setup is a bum for the road. 8-speed non-MD is a rare beast, indeed, and I'm talking Unicorn-Rare here. Best bet is to find a non-MD, 7-speed body and retrofit it onto an 8-spd body, if you don't want to replace the entire hub. You can mill or carefully grind off the threads on the 12-tooth cog for the 11-tooth one to provide clearance.
Eventually, you can just throw the whole setup away and replace it with a suitable Shimano-compatible hub. The spacing is plenty close enough to provide excellent interchangeability. You have to match the shifters and rear derailleur, but your Suntour setup will happily shift a Shimano cassette. Ditto for freewheels, and you can get a 13-28, 7-spd Shimano freewheel for less than 20 bucks that will thread right on your beautiful, threaded Suntour hub. Couple that with a $15 chain and you have excellent shifting fro the unwashed masses.
