Scottish independence

Whether independense was gained or not I feel the debate is good, it might shake up the stale state of politics in the UK. I personally am sick of the little changes between governments who are all broadly middle of the road and more concerned with holding power and slagging off the last government. An independent Scotland would have to at least in the short term be more interesting as we had to get all our systems working. Alternatively a close vote would tell West Minster that they cant ignore us and a total no landslide would be a legitimate reason for greater integration of the UK. Hopefully something better than the status quo will result.
Thing I find weirdest though is UKIP and Tories want a United Kingdom but much of the latter and all of the former want a disunited Europe. Is it because West Minster calls the shots in the UK, ie its Top Dog yet in EU, Brussels calls the shots and West Minster isn't the Alpha. If this was definitely the case then I would definitely vote for independence as I will not be subject to Imperial decree willingly. As there are no definites my mind is not yet made up but I find my eyes constantly rolling as yet more reasons for why Scotland cant go it alone keep coming out of London, such as from the Bank of England. A proper UK should have a Bank of UK, it sounds imperialist and oppressive for an institution that calls the shots on UK economic policy to be so England centric. I know that sounds petty but thats just one of many things that do upset the nationalists.
So to summarise my hopes:
Independence, everything changes
Close run No vote, Devo Max given serious consideration, thus stuff changes
No contest No Vote, maybe greater integration but please some change not the status quo pleeeeaaaassssseeeee !!!!

Oh and UP THE FLATLANDERS !!!!!! :D
 
I’m not clear on what the ‘yes’ voters actually want for Scotland.

The only way Scotland will be fully independent is by the creation of its own currency. Without this monetary policy will be dictated from elsewhere be it The bank of England or the EU. There seems to be no talk of this so I am confused how Scotland could become fully independent?

Does Scotland want full independence or just grater social/legal powers, which I though they already had?
 
It is annoying that the SNP which has had decades to figure out what it wants and what it needs to do still seems to have gaping holes in its plans.
Reminds me of the Green Party, you cant base your entire campaign stategy on one idea, whats the Green parties policy on Tax, Employment,Defence etc.
Scotland is not a county of England, lets make this clear. We are a historically seperate country that share administration with the other parts of the UK. Elements withing Scotland want a return to full independence, others want greater self rule without full independence, yet more are happy with the Status Quo and others again want a return to West Minster rule.
All groups need a clear idea of what they want and how it can be achieved.
Otherwise forums like this will be full of confused people and worse people like me who will get a vote in the independence referendum who cant get a clear picture of whats what :x

As for currency, lets go back to the Groat or the Bawby though our current pound value Bank notes are already different :roll:
 
I assume Salmond and his band will be up for taking their share of the National Debt on if they go...

This minor (!) point never seems to get mentioned when discussing whetehr Scotland could stand on it's own two feet economically.
 
ringo":2jg6zlzj said:
I assume Salmond and his band will be up for taking their share of the National Debt on if they go...

This minor (!) point never seems to get mentioned when discussing whetehr Scotland could stand on it's own two feet economically.
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That’s a fair point. The whole affair seems ridiculously complicated.

As a separate country would not everything need to be renegotiated? Currency, trade, taxation, defence, investments, free movement etc, the implication seem huge yet AS seems to paint the picture that the separation would be straight forward.

Surly there is a better solution to the issue than an complete split, it almost makes me think that the driving factor for independence is not about creating a better environment for the Scots but more so the mentality of being free from the English.

To me this seem crazy as no county is truly free to behave totally independently nowadays.
 
In the absence of having any answers to difficult questions, the nationalists have reverted to negative type - it is all Westminster's fault”
End Quote
Alistair Darling

Better Together campaign

This quote may be true but it also reflects politics in the UK as Mr Darling is himself just flinging insults and his own party frequently blames the previous Labour government for all of their failings and likewise labour blames the torries.

Step forward with well thought out arguements and honestly answer all questions so the electorate can make an informed decision.

it almost makes me think that the driving factor for independence is not about creating a better environment for the Scots but more so the mentality of being free from the English.
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There is a lot that is true in that statement even if it reflects poorly on us Scots. Unfortunately no Englishman can understand as they have not been indoctrinated from birth. We have been conditioned to take umbridge at the least slight, a classic being if Andy Murray wins a tennis match he's a great British athlete but if he loses he's a Scotsman, we're only proper UK members if we make Britain shine. Another classic is the majority of the UK citizens are English and never tell anyone they're British or UK citizens hence the rest of the world assumes the UK is just another name for England. When i speak foreigners say, oh your English, i correct them and make a joke about what dangerous waters they're in. I dont hate you England but you will never understand what the Scotland/England relationship is because your not Scots. The Irish and Welsh would probably agree on this point.

Unfortunately come the vote, a lot will vote with their hearts not their heads......Sorry :roll:
 
Sadly I feel that should the yes vote succeed then the mental divide between England and Scotland will only increase leaving both parties worse off then before.

It would be a huge step backwards in my mind, although potentially shorted lived due to the increasing integration between countries.

A divided UK would only increase the calls/pressure on England and Scotland to join the EU leading to even less independence for both parties.

Maybe this is the future however full membership of the EU seem more like assimilation rather than integration. After four hundred years of union between England and Scotland the Scottish culture, spirit and identity is still going strong, I doubts we will be able to say the same following full integration of the EU.
 
When you read this please take into consideration..that this a calm disscusion between us all and no raised voices!!!

This would be a shame if Scotland became independant..as from an International perspective as the world looks in its better we are one.

I was born in Swansea..mum and dad are English..i refer to myself as a "Brit" /British

I work within the MoD..i have colleagues who work in Coulport and Faslane..i know how much that would effect the local communities if these were to close and relocate..Falmouth in Cornwall has been looked into it could take the Trident Bombers..these will have a another refit at Devonport over the next 10 years

The North sea oil issue...how long has that got..i am asking as i dont know.

Free universaties/education..free dental care..free care for the elderly..free perscriptions..this all has to be funded and paid for..how could this done raise your taxes..again please tell me i dont know

Andy Murray..being referred to as a Brit if he wins and a Scot if he loses..didnt Andy wear south American team shirt and openly support this team when they played England!!..i am afraid media has a lot to play on this

Is Mr Salmon going to ask 16 and 17 year olds to vote for independance so he is in with a chance of getting what he wants..lets face it what we thought about when we were 16/17 years old our views does not have any bearing on what we think now

The vote will decide..and all the debt goes with it..you cant pick and choose.I hope this will put an end to the ill feeling that sometimes raises its head. if a Scot has a moan at me or a "pop" at english..i will just say you had the vote and the majority of your fellow country did not want independance :?

We are all adults here

Ernie :wink:
 
I'm a strong believer in democracy, if the votes for Independence then I'm Scottish, if for the Union I'm British. Currently I'm British though I'd favour a United Republic but thats just me and a different debate entirely. There does need to be more effort to emphasise how good it is to be British though. If the Scots still have a problem after 300 years then getting the many ethnic minorities within the UK to be British first is going to be a tough excercise. Lets all be British and Proud and Lets all be European and Proud, fighting the break up of the UK but supporting the breakaway from Europe seems daft:D
Still dont know how I'll vote though, only time will tell.
 
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