Name that frame... titanium

[red_riviera]

Just picked this titanium frame up at a bargain price. Previous owner says he bought it from the manager of a Norwich bike shop a few years ago. It was his own bike and allegedly a pre-production prototype - but he would not divulge the manufacturer.

Judging by the lack of disc tabs I reckon it's probably pre-1999. It's 18" ctr-to-top, 56cm top tube, 31.8mm seat tube, takes 27.2mm seatpost (no internal shim), 68mm BB shell, welded top-route cable guides, externally butted head tube, curved seat & chain stays and it weighs just over 1.6 kg. The dropout circular cutouts seem quite distinctive. The welds appear pretty good, if slightly inconsistent which leads me to think it's hand-welded and not done by a robot. I'm going to get it eddy current tested to try and find out if it's CP Ti or 3Al/2.5V.

Big pics here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/35229453@N00/sets/72157625023165866/show/

Does anyone have any idea as to it's origins? Thanks!

 

[Tad]

I have no idea what it is but I'm quite jealous, it does look lovely.

 

[gibbleking]

maybe a cyman

i had his carbon hubs on my shogun before it got pilched.
io remember being shown a ti frame he did ...makes me think of that one..

 

[red_riviera]

maybe a cyman

i had his carbon hubs on my shogun before it got pilched.
io remember being shown a ti frame he did ...makes me think of that one..

hmmm.. weren't they were based in E.Anglia as well? Would make sense if it found it's way to a Norwich bike shop at some point. Thanks GK!

Anyway, more clues: I've done a bit of material analysis using eddy currents and a pure Ti reference block as comparison.

The eddy current balance point was nowhere near that of the pure Ti reference block. So the frame is definitely NOT pure titanium... it must be a titanium alloy.

The main tubes, dropouts and cable guides have virtually the same balance point... since dropouts are often made from 6Al/4V Ti alloy, I'm pretty confident that's what the main tubes are too. The stays have a different balance point, closer to that of the main tubes than the pure Ti block. So I reckon the stays are the more common 3Al/2.5V Ti alloy.

I believe Litespeed used to combine 6Al/4V and 3Al/2.5V for some of their higher end frames and used an externally butted head tube on some models. So this could be a Litespeed clone?

 

[the great roberto]

unlikely to be pure Ti. most likely ASTM grade 5.
Stick a lump of that into the metascope thingy and compare with your frame.

nice frame btw

 

[red_riviera]

unlikely to be pure Ti. most likely ASTM grade 5.
Stick a lump of that into the metascope thingy and compare with your frame.

nice frame btw

Thanks!

When I say 'pure' I suppose I mean 'commercially pure'. The reference block is used for setting up eddy current crack detection equipment for inspecting aircraft parts.

 

[cannondale king]

that looks like the frame the manager had in apple pie in norwich for some time out back looks well msde though

 

[red_riviera]

bump - any more info please?

 

[red_riviera]

now built up here: http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?p=963920

 

[red_riviera]