Marin-Team-Issue
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W W Biffta
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he's quoted me 3080g all in, so probbaly no less than 1.9kg, i was hoping around 1.7 looking at teh superight tube spec and size of the frame. dunno, could be the stem is a monster or something.
I agree that it's most likely 1.9 out of 3.08kg, but I wouldn't be disappointed with 1.9 - that's as light as Tange Prestige (or any other 8-5-8 based tubeset) gets.
I did once see a picture of a Ritchey race team frame on a scale at 1.74 or something like that. That's what the tubes weigh, but you do need the odd little luxury like paint, welds, dropouts, bridges etc, so how could a frame weigh that? Well, excluding the possibility that his scale was way out, he did say that he had seen one of those frames broken in a race and Tom Ritchey had said 'oh well, they're only designed to last a season and at least that one got most of the way there'.
That made me wonder whether TR made his real team frames with some road tubes that Tange wouldn't sanction for mtb use. Just speculation, but that would be consistent with his remark. If he had used sanctioned mtb tubes, he would expect them to withstand xc racing stresses pretty much forever, not just one season.
Even then, I'd be slightly surprised that the team riders wanted a frame as light as that. They'd surely want mtb stays to get the power down, and I guess the argument for a front triangle made of road tubes was based on needing compliance in an era of rigid forks. Once suspension came in, there was no argument for racing with a frame as flexy as that. e.g., the Kona King Kahuna was developed partly so the race team could use it in preference to the lighter but (at least in their hands) slower Hei Hei.
I did once see a picture of a Ritchey race team frame on a scale at 1.74 or something like that. That's what the tubes weigh, but you do need the odd little luxury like paint, welds, dropouts, bridges etc, so how could a frame weigh that? Well, excluding the possibility that his scale was way out, he did say that he had seen one of those frames broken in a race and Tom Ritchey had said 'oh well, they're only designed to last a season and at least that one got most of the way there'.
That made me wonder whether TR made his real team frames with some road tubes that Tange wouldn't sanction for mtb use. Just speculation, but that would be consistent with his remark. If he had used sanctioned mtb tubes, he would expect them to withstand xc racing stresses pretty much forever, not just one season.
Even then, I'd be slightly surprised that the team riders wanted a frame as light as that. They'd surely want mtb stays to get the power down, and I guess the argument for a front triangle made of road tubes was based on needing compliance in an era of rigid forks. Once suspension came in, there was no argument for racing with a frame as flexy as that. e.g., the Kona King Kahuna was developed partly so the race team could use it in preference to the lighter but (at least in their hands) slower Hei Hei.
manitou916
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W W Biffta
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yup 1.9 is not bad for prestige, the frame im using now is that. only other frame i know made of superlight is a voodoo bizango, which i think was around 1750g for that size, so seemed a reasonable hope. ive seen quite alot of steel frames around the 1750 mark, mostly columbus nivacrome tubes and hand made, but the bontranger racelite was true temper 4130, so im taking that as a the benchmark for a lightweight steel frame 
im a bit wierd tho cos i probably carry my bike half the time i use it. ritchey p20 or a plexus is what i really want but a bit out of my price range.
im a bit wierd tho cos i probably carry my bike half the time i use it. ritchey p20 or a plexus is what i really want but a bit out of my price range.
