How do today's bikes compare to the 80s and 90s?

[mattr]

Re: Re:

.Given the price of a new 11 speed 105 group (circa 300-350 gbp on what seems constant sale price) versus the equivalent group price for Chorus suggests that they aren't of the same quality. In saying that I am not put off the new 105, contemplating it for a touring bike where function and robustness is far more important than aesthetics.

FWIW, chorus has never been equivalent to 105, ultegra maybe. But the groupset hierarchy has got very confused over the last few years, with eps, di2, all the various versions of record (Must be at least 15 by now!) and a couple of campag groups that have disappeared then been reborn (Athena?) then all the extra stuff from sram confusing things even more.
The best thing to do is pick the budget and features you want, then get the best bike you can for the budget.

 

[mattr]

Re: Re:

A friend has just bought a Giant something or other with Ultegra, the price tag started with with a 2 with three more digits before the decimal point. He got that in a sale and had to upgrade the wheels. At that sort of money I'd be after and 80's icon with full C-Record

probably a TCR, which with a different group set wouldn't be out of place under a protour rider.

And a lot of top end bikes come with wheels from slightly down the range, as people spending 3/4/5 grand on a bike will quite possibly already have a top end pair of wheels for racing only. Or might not want super duper aero wheels, as they live in the alps. They want some super duper climbing wheels.
So the person speccing the bike keeps everyone happy by having some good training wheels on there.

IIRC canyon offer several different bikes with very similar specs, the only major change being wheels. On some models. Not all!

 

[Gabe-62]

It depends what you mean by quality.
If you mean durability and finish, not much will compare to 80s/90s campag (or Shimano for that matter).
On the other hand, the operability is at least an order of magnitude better.
The latest and greatest groupsets will do front shifts up and down and multiple shifts across the block, either way, all while under power. The shifts will always be right, click, shift, done. You won't need to ever give the lever a little nudge to stop the rattling of a slightly misaligned rear mech. (The downside to this is when you don't look after it, the shifts go to crap after a few months of abuse, and you have no option to easily adjust on the go)
Brakes, well, you can get the back wheel in the air with one finger on the front brake in the dry. Two or three fingers will have the same effect in the wet. If you have enough grip.
"Training" wheels are pretty much comparable to race wheels of the 80s, lighter, stiffer, more aerodynamic, longer lasting. Race wheels, it's just budget dependant, and a lot of the £2k+ wheels, you are paying for exclusivity and the development budget (most expensive I've seen are knocking on the door of £4k)
Frames, except for the weight, there *really* isn't a huge difference except the fashions of geometry and fit. I've ridden a lot of the current crop of carbon wonder bikes, and I've still not upgraded from my 90s made to measure steel frame. It has however got this year's ultegra 11 on it (which outperforms the D-A 9 I ran on the same frame when I raced, and the chorus/record 8 i had on it before. When it was new.
If you'd asked the same question comparing a bike from the mid/late 90s. A lot of it is incremental changes. So you *might* not notice a huge difference. But if you are if the down tube shifter era (as I am) it's night and day.

Great, thnx for that. Makes me feel happier about not spending stooooooooopid money to begin with !

 

[Gabe-62]

Re: Re:

.Given the price of a new 11 speed 105 group (circa 300-350 gbp on what seems constant sale price) versus the equivalent group price for Chorus suggests that they aren't of the same quality. In saying that I am not put off the new 105, contemplating it for a touring bike where function and robustness is far more important than aesthetics.

FWIW, chorus has never been equivalent to 105, ultegra maybe. But the groupset hierarchy has got very confused over the last few years, with eps, di2, all the various versions of record (Must be at least 15 by now!) and a couple of campag groups that have disappeared then been reborn (Athena?) then all the extra stuff from sram confusing things even more.
The best thing to do is pick the budget and features you want, then get the best bike you can for the budget.

Good advice I think, and together with Matt's reassurances, I think I'll probably with my gut and go with the Canyon 105 or Ultegra (£1250 / £1500) carbon offering.

I also need the "Sportive" (crikey - call it the club-run already !!!) geometry at my age (!!!) - which the Canyon bikes apparently offer.

I will report back.

 

[dirttorpedo]

Modern 105 is very nice and I doubt you get much more bang for your buck going up to Ultegra or Dura Ace. I think at that point you're just paying for less weight. Can't say how they stack up to retro Campy though, but I think you'd find it just fine. I like old bikes, but using a good quality system with brifters is trans-formative.

 

[legrandefromage]

This is absurd 'value' at £799 and gets you all the 'technology' you could possibly want - I didnt buy it as I just cant find it nice to look at everyday

I plumped for a very retro looking steel frame with modern budget components found in a sale:

To replace:

 

[legrandefromage]

Road components havent really changed since Hyperglide came in. You'll recognize everything and will be comfortable with modern groupsets but modern frame aesthetics may be the issue.

I'd find a nice steel frame that you have always liked and get a modern groupset fitted

 

[dirttorpedo]

Re:

Road components havent really changed since Hyperglide came in. You'll recognize everything and will be comfortable with modern groupsets but modern frame aesthetics may be the issue.

I'd find a nice steel frame that you have always liked and get a modern groupset fitted

I agree. I'm riding "old" ultegra drivetrain with modern brifters and a compact crank and it works nice. Just upgraded from 9 speed to 10 for a bit of extra hill climbing punch because its hilly where I live. I think you could go a generation or two earlier and do the same thing and it would work well and look nicer than the darth vader looking new stuff.

 

[fastpedaller]

Re:

Lots of useful advice above so who am I to repeat it - For my 2p worth, back in the late 70's I had a suntour cyclone rear mech, and it gave a great change - I saved hard and bought a Campag Nuovo Record one, and it didn't compare (the change was far worse!) It was all due to Japanese design, where Suntour had introduced their patented slant parallelogram system which worked far better - the campag invariably went from 3rd to 5th sprocket with a small movement, and to get 4th from 3rd you went to 5th and back! Well know 'feature' and not just my poor set up. Now all rear mechs have a slant parallelogram. Japanese innovation!!!! but the campag bearing and general build quality was superior!

 

[legrandefromage]

Campagnolo shifting was terrible - the above Raleigh had a Gran Sport mech and it just sucked