Fat Chance Kickstarter

[sinnerman]

Re: Re:

The steel wasn’t cheap, bets on cost for a ti f&f?

Bet you only buy knock off designer gear too . Never ceases to amaze me how many modern ‘cool’ bike designers are still ripping off FAT CHANCE original designs. Many dont ‘get’ the ‘GREATS’ of mountainbike design and their high prices, Cunninghams, Potts, etc designs copied by most mass producers but try and get a proper ride on one and then compare.

I like genuine gear, and not knock off.

But despite the name, the history, etc, you will be buying a Brand name, but built by someone else......, Is that not the same thing....?

Your analogy is true but flawed, its like saying a Klein or as some like to call it a Kleiningham is a rip off of a Cunningham when its isnt, sure they are both made of Aluminium but both builders/companies have there own take on things with some natural overlap.

And there are no original ideas/designs.........(quote) If you go back in history far enough, everything had been done before...."Keith Bontrager".

A Point of Fact.

Look at any modern Fat Chance, (made by others) What is it that separates there design from the vast majority of others. Next to nothing, apart from the Brand name and Clever Marketing. (FACT).

 

[WWC]

Re: Re:

The steel wasn’t cheap, bets on cost for a ti f&f?

Bet you only buy knock off designer gear too . Never ceases to amaze me how many modern ‘cool’ bike designers are still ripping off FAT CHANCE original designs. Many dont ‘get’ the ‘GREATS’ of mountainbike design and their high prices, Cunninghams, Potts, etc designs copied by most mass producers but try and get a proper ride on one and then compare.

Ha!

I’ll have you know I take quality very seriously!

BUT I tend to pick up ‘pre-loved’ or used bargains.

Recently picked up a Jeff Jones original ti spaceframe & fork for £1000.

Let’s take a punt and say £4500 for a new ti yo frame?

I’d take the used jones but then there are those with more cash...

 

[sinnerman]

Re: Re:

The steel wasn’t cheap, bets on cost for a ti f&f?

Bet you only buy knock off designer gear too . Never ceases to amaze me how many modern ‘cool’ bike designers are still ripping off FAT CHANCE original designs. Many dont ‘get’ the ‘GREATS’ of mountainbike design and their high prices, Cunninghams, Potts, etc designs copied by most mass producers but try and get a proper ride on one and then compare.

Dont get me Wrong, i love the Nostalgia as much as the next, and a brand resurrection is good for us all, and good for his pocket, which was the reason. Im just not as easily coerced by clever marketing as i was when i was 14.

But lets face it, based on your own point, for the money involved, your not far off having a Cunningham made for you anyway, (if Charlie wasn't so unwell).

Or you could buy something totally original built by the guy whos name is on the frame, like the Frank the Welder Special, and raise money for a genuine cause.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/352619414590?ul_noapp=true

 

[M-Power]

Re:

Ferrari didnt invent the motor car. Their cars werent made by Enzo Ferrari or his direct descendants personally but their employees, sub contractors & fabricators etc. Its a premium aspirational product, which still embodies the perfectionist ethos and competitive drive of the Company Founder. Some people spend £5-15K buying a replica Ferrari to Chav about outside an Essex night club thinking its just as good (fools the birds) as a real one, as it runs on gas, has 4 wheels, makes noise and looks similar. Other manufacturers make faster cars, at a price. A lucky few are fortunate to have the means and determination to buy a used or genuine new one because they always wanted one. Its a choice you make. Life is short, yolo. Plenty on so called basic income spend the price of a supercar over a lifetime or less on fags, booze and drugs. Its a choice we make

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 3673189650

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 4244809438

Cheap FAT Ti https://ebay.us/gRXHRe

:mrgreen:

 

[sinnerman]

Re: Re:

Ferrari didnt invent the motor car. Their cars werent made by Enzo Ferrari or his direct descendants personally but their employees, sub contractors & fabricators etc. Its a premium aspirational product, which still embodies the perfectionist ethos and competitive drive of the Company Founder. Some people spend £5-15K buying a replica Ferrari to Chav about outside an Essex night club thinking its just as good (fools the birds) as a real one, as it runs on gas, has 4 wheels, makes noise and looks similar. Other manufacturers make faster cars, at a price. A lucky few are fortunate to have the means and determination to buy a used or genuine new one because they always wanted one. Its a choice you make. Life is short, yolo. Plenty on so called basic income spend the price of a supercar over a lifetime or less on fags, booze and drugs. Its a choice we make

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 3673189650

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 4244809438

Cheap FAT Ti https://ebay.us/gRXHRe

:mrgreen:

You are of course completely right. Enzo didnt make any claims about his cars being handbuilt by him, nor did he stand with a welding torch for a photo shoot, in the hope potential consumers would believe it so.

And of course you are right, Some are so overwhelmed taken in by the marketing propaganda of a brand and product, there love affair wont be dashed by any level of common sense at all.
Some will go to unbridled lengths with imitations even when the pocket doesn't run to it.

Im sure the folk in Essex wont like you blaming them for "the blinded by the light" scenario though. Good Marketing Propaganda is a Global phenomenon, not just Essex based to be fair.

 

[M-Power]

Re:

You are of course completely right. Enzo didnt make any claims about his cars being handbuilt by him, nor did he stand with a welding torch for a photo shoot, in the hope potential consumers would believe it so.

He has built his own bikes in the past from scratch FACT and i have no doubt still does to a very high standard. Plenty of pics of him ‘using’ the torch since his comeback and not just to light his blunt. As the Principal of his business, its his prerogative to employ ‘others’ with similar or even better welding ability to do most of the work. IROBOT being the best imo. He’s been through a lot over the years and is putting himself out there again with a lean comeback operation. I am a big fan of start up businesses. Its very tough out there. Easy to knock people.

The number of spin off companies after FAT CITY CYCLES closed in 94 is amazing 30 + Many of the ex employees talk fondly of their time there and are clearly still enamoured with the FAT CHANCE brand comeback. That all speaks volumes to me. So, what recognition have you achieved in life ?

How many of the bikes in your esteemed collection were all fully hand made by the Company Principal with photographic proof of course ? Chas Roberts had frame builders etc Yet another FAT segmented fork rip-off from Zinn too So enlighten me about all the original designs from the likes of Zinn, Roberts, Dave Lloyd et al ?

And of course you are right, Some are so overwhelmed taken in by the marketing propaganda of a brand and product, there love affair wont be dashed by any level of common sense at all.

Nothing to do with common sense. Its personal preference based on lots of experience owning and test riding numerous models and other iconic brands over the years from the retro era.

Some will go to unbridled lengths with imitations even when the pocket doesn't run to it. Im sure the folk in Essex wont like you blaming them for "the blinded by the light" scenario though. Good Marketing Propaganda is a Global phenomenon, not just Essex based to be fair.[/quote]

Not ‘blaming’ anybody. I have spent plenty of time around Chelmsford, Loughton and the Essex club scene in my youth and seen such monstrosities first hand, plenty about. The transition paint Diablo will forever stick in my mind Whats daft is the money wasted modifying a replica when a genuine base model could have been bought for not much more, becoming an appreciating asset with free motoring

I get the Iconoclastic agenda nevertheless :mrgreen:

 

[sinnerman]

Re: Re:

You are of course completely right. Enzo didnt make any claims about his cars being handbuilt by him, nor did he stand with a welding torch for a photo shoot, in the hope potential consumers would believe it so.

He has built his own bikes in the past from scratch FACT and i have no doubt still does to a very high standard. Plenty of pics of him ‘using’ the torch since his comeback and not just to light his blunt. As the Principal of his business, its his prerogative to employ ‘others’ with similar or even better welding ability to do most of the work. IROBOT being the best imo. He’s been through a lot over the years and is putting himself out there again with a lean comeback operation. I am a big fan of start up businesses. Its very tough out there. Easy to knock people.

The number of spin off companies after FAT CITY CYCLES closed in 94 is amazing 30 + Many of the ex employees talk fondly of their time there and are clearly still enamoured with the FAT CHANCE brand comeback. That all speaks volumes to me. So, what recognition have you achieved in life ?

How many of the bikes in your esteemed collection were all fully hand made by the Company Principal with photographic proof of course ? Chas Roberts had frame builders etc Yet another FAT segmented fork rip-off from Zinn too So enlighten me about all the original designs from the likes of Zinn, Roberts, Dave Lloyd et al ?

And of course you are right, Some are so overwhelmed taken in by the marketing propaganda of a brand and product, there love affair wont be dashed by any level of common sense at all.

Nothing to do with common sense. Its personal preference based on lots of experience owning and test riding numerous models and other iconic brands over the years from the retro era.

Some will go to unbridled lengths with imitations even when the pocket doesn't run to it. Im sure the folk in Essex wont like you blaming them for "the blinded by the light" scenario though. Good Marketing Propaganda is a Global phenomenon, not just Essex based to be fair.

Not ‘blaming’ anybody. I have spent plenty of time around Chelmsford, Loughton and the Essex club scene in my youth and seen such monstrosities first hand, plenty about. The transition paint Diablo will forever stick in my mind Whats daft is the money wasted modifying a replica when a genuine base model could have been bought for not much more, becoming an appreciating asset with free motoring

I get the Iconoclastic agenda nevertheless :mrgreen:[/quote]


There is nothing wrong with you having a religious veneration for Chris Chance, we all get it....

 

[M-Power]

Re:

Sometimes drinking the Coolaid copiously is actually worth it Essex is the capital of fake, fake tan, teeth, boobs, cars etc. They celebrate it and laugh about it, maybe thats why they are so popular on Tv.











Keep it FAT :mrgreen:

 

[pete_mcc]

Re: Re:

Recently picked up a Jeff Jones original ti spaceframe & fork for £1000.

Ooo, tease! Is it one of the straight line frames before he went all swoopy? Have you got a thread? Can I have it when you’re done?

 

[WWC]

Re: Re:

Recently picked up a Jeff Jones original ti spaceframe & fork for £1000.

Ooo, tease! Is it one of the straight line frames before he went all swoopy? Have you got a thread? Can I have it when you’re done?

I would say apologies to the op for the thread hijack but apparently that’s me so here’s a link:

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=393095&p=2907339#p2907339

It’s pre-offshore and pre-merlin made by Jones apparently.

Quite early I think...