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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 9:52 am 
rBoTM Winner
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Location: Vienna, Austria
If like me you're constantly frustrated by sellers trying to pass Campagnolo items off as C-Record then I figured it might be useful to attempt to state a few facts about what actually are genuine C-Record (Corsa Record) parts.

I am still a relative novice to this myself so please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

I understand C-Record to be Record Groupset items produced between 1985 and 1990.

Correct C-Record items include
Crankset - Gen 1 (engraved shield) and Gen 2 (painted shield) 4-arm spider with hidden 5th bolt. Despite being used with early 1980's 8sp Ergo groups this remained a C-Record item.
Headset - Generic Chorus/Record square nut with holes in upper race.
Brake levers - Gen 1 (white hood Cobalto style) and Gen 2 (Aero with Power Grade adjustment)
Brake calipers - SR-style Cobalto with italic script and of course Deltas
Seatpost - Thinner more minimalist single bolt design without flat sides. I've seen these with and without shield and were used with later Record and Chorus groupsets.
Hubs - C-Record was never 8sp cassette, strictly 7 (and possibly 8) spd freewheel. Low and High Flange (Sherifs Star) Hubs had removable central oil port clip.
Shifters - Strictly DT shifters only, friction and Syncro. There were many designs but I suspect it's fair to say any DT shifters with shields on their blades are C-Record though i know these were also seen on Chorus and Athena equipped bikes.
Front derailleur - There was only one, the gloriously over-engineered and slightly larger unit with the dovetail pivot. came in the band-on version with the 2-point flexible band plus a braze-on version.
Rear derailleur - Gen 1 (no hole in lower cage) and Gen 2 (with hole) i.e.the only Campagnolo rear derailleurs which displayed a shield instead of text though the later 1992 version featured text in an attempt to make it part of the pre-Ergo record group of the year.

With the exception of some C-Record specific pedals, rims, clips etc I think it's fair to say that if items aren't any of the above then they just aint C-Record.

Image

Items that are NOT C-Record based on frequent misconceptions.
Crankset - Chorus, Croce d'Aune, Athena
Headset - Generic Chorus/Record/Athena square nut without holes in upper race.
Brake levers - Athena/Chorus/Record aero levers without Power Grade adjustment.
Brake calipers - Monoplanars, Athena D100 central pivot, gen 2 Super Record (italic script) and all later dual-pivot
Seatpost - The generic flat-sided record/Athena/Chorus unit shield or no shield.
Hubs - Any 8sp cassette hub and any hub without the removable oil port clip plus Chorus & CDA freewheel hubs which also have the oil port.
Shifters - All Ergos plus any shifter that has the text 'Campagnolo'
Front derailleur - Anything that doesn't have the massive dovetail main pivot.
Rear derailleur - Well, all really, there was only the one C-Record design.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 1:52 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2013 10:04 pm
Posts: 320
Thanks for taking the time to post this. I find the whole Campagnolo identification thing a bit of a minefield but even I get irked by seeing Campag Victory mechs passed off as C- Record.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:18 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:38 pm
Posts: 1470
Location: The Lovely Lincolnshire Wolds and by the sea in Sussex
agentorange wrote:
If like me you're constantly frustrated by sellers trying to pass Campagnolo items off as C-Record then I figured it might be useful to attempt to state a few facts about what actually are genuine C-Record (Corsa Record) parts.

I am still a relative novice to this myself so please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

I understand C-Record to be Record Groupset items produced between 1985 and 1990.

Correct C-Record items include
Crankset - Gen 1 (engraved shield) and Gen 2 (painted shield) 4-arm spider with hidden 5th bolt. Despite being used with early 1980's 8sp Ergo groups this remained a C-Record item.
Headset - Generic Chorus/Record square nut with holes in upper race.
Brake levers - Gen 1 (white hood Cobalto style) and Gen 2 (Aero with Power Grade adjustment)
Brake calipers - SR-style Cobalto with italic script and of course Deltas
Seatpost - Thinner more minimalist single bolt design without flat sides. I've seen these with and without shield and were used with later Record and Chorus groupsets.
Hubs - C-Record was never 8sp cassette, strictly 7 (and possibly 8) spd freewheel. Low and High Flange (Sherifs Star) Hubs had removable central oil port clip.
Shifters - Strictly DT shifters only, friction and Syncro. There were many designs but I suspect it's fair to say any DT shifters with shields on their blades are C-Record though i know these were also seen on Chorus and Athena equipped bikes.
Front derailleur - There was only one, the gloriously over-engineered and slightly larger unit with the dovetail pivot. came in the band-on version with the 2-point flexible band plus a braze-on version.
Rear derailleur - Gen 1 (no hole in lower cage) and Gen 2 (with hole) i.e.the only Campagnolo rear derailleurs which displayed a shield instead of text though the later 1992 version featured text in an attempt to make it part of the pre-Ergo record group of the year.

With the exception of some C-Record specific pedals, rims, clips etc I think it's fair to say that if items aren't any of the above then they just aint C-Record.

Image

Items that are NOT C-Record based on frequent misconceptions.
Crankset - Chorus, Croce d'Aune, Athena
Headset - Generic Chorus/Record/Athena square nut without holes in upper race.
Brake levers - Athena/Chorus/Record aero levers without Power Grade adjustment.
Brake calipers - Monoplanars, Athena D100 central pivot, gen 2 Super Record (italic script) and all later dual-pivot
Seatpost - The generic flat-sided record/Athena/Chorus unit shield or no shield.
Hubs - Any 8sp cassette hub and any hub without the removable oil port clip plus Chorus & CDA freewheel hubs which also have the oil port.
Shifters - All Ergos plus any shifter that has the text 'Campagnolo'
Front derailleur - Anything that doesn't have the massive dovetail main pivot.
Rear derailleur - Well, all really, there was only the one C-Record design.


A good idea, but you have to be accurate. For example, if we just consider the rear derailleur; the first generation (I bought one new) has an engraved shield on the body and no jockey wheel housing cutaways.

The second generation does not have the engraved shield it has a painted Campagnolo text on the body and a semi circular cutaway on the outer lower jockey wheel housing.

Good idea, but most of this is to be found on Velobase.

Jon.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:43 pm 
rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:06 pm
Posts: 1443
Location: Vienna, Austria
roadking wrote:

A good idea, but you have to be accurate. For example, if we just consider the rear derailleur; the first generation (I bought one new) has an engraved shield on the body and no jockey wheel housing cutaways.

The second generation does not have the engraved shield it has a painted Campagnolo text on the body and a semi circular cutaway on the outer lower jockey wheel housing.

Good idea, but most of this is to be found on Velobase.

Jon.


Yes, pretty sure that's what I said, by 'holes' I'm referring to the cutaways & yes, as per above, the gen 2 version with the 'Campagnolo' script instead of the shield was the version they sold prior to the introduction of the short-lived and quite lovely 8sp Ergo-based unit.

Velobase is good but as it's user-generated content it can't always be relied on.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 5:34 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:38 pm
Posts: 1470
Location: The Lovely Lincolnshire Wolds and by the sea in Sussex
agentorange wrote:
Velobase is good but as it's user-generated content it can't always be relied on.


Agree with that.

Jon.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:40 am 
rBoTM Winner
rBoTM Winner

Joined: Fri May 20, 2011 5:59 pm
Posts: 641
Location: West Yorkshire
agentorange wrote:
Headset - Generic Chorus/Record square nut with holes in upper race.


According to the 1988 catalogue there is a difference between the Record and Chorus headsets. The parts are all the same including the 3/16" bearings except apparently the lower cup that fits into the head tube. The Record part number is 1131059 while the Chorus (also supplied with CdA) is 1131049 unless that is a typo in the catalogue - I don't think so because the overall part codes are A0D0 (Record) and C0D0 (Chorus). I don't know how to tell the difference though :?


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 12:48 pm 
rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:28 pm
Posts: 3104
Location: Mansfield Woodhouse, Nott's.
Is there any need to ''quote'' the Original Posters post with the picture still attached ?

Does my head in when you start to see the same friggin picture!
Not so long there was a thread and the OP post had been quoted
several times complete with the same god damn photo's! If you are
to reply with the OP ''quote'' please remove the flipping picture.

Rant over, why the rant you say? ....Cos' I'm bloody pee'd off thats why Image


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 2:30 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:21 pm
Posts: 589
I share your frustration, but am curious as to why you consider Corsa Record to end at 1990?

Major changes (dual pivot brakes, Ergo shifters) didn't occur until 1992 and even then it is clearly of the same family.

For me, the C-Record era lasted until 1994, with a major overhaul for 1995.

I agree that VB needs to be treated with caution, but (with all due respect) isn't this thread also UGC?

A useful exercise certainly, but the catalogues are the only source I implicitly trust.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 4:46 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2015 7:24 pm
Posts: 255
Location: Staffordshire
I found a source on the web with all of the catalogues (I'll try to remember what it was) when I was researching my latest C-record equipped bike. Its a bit more complex than this. For example, in 1987, there were 4 different styles of pedal.


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