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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:04 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:55 am
Posts: 2920
Location: Dorset
Hi all,

I am interested in what training plans you all have, we have some experienced riders on here with a wealth of knowledge.

I am 42 so no spring chicken but pretty fit for my age having taken part in Martial Arts for 15 years. I can ride at a modest 12/13/14 average speed for hours on end and have no issues with stamina, I am able to climb some damn steep hills around the Dorset area albeit very slowly.

BUT :(

I have been on a few club rides but am easily the slowest one and always end up getting dropped early on, even in the slow group especially on hills some of which is down to my old steel bike and its gearing (which will soon be tweaked :wink: ) I am ok with this, and will put these rides on hold until I have gained enough speed and strength to keep up. When I am fitter/stringer I will go back and destroy them :twisted:

Just need some advice on what I should concentrate on, I want a simple plan without resorting to heartbeat monitors and cadence meters - at least for now.

Luckily I am able to cycle most days of the week at the moment.

Should I just get the miles in, concentrate on hills or both. Set up my own timetrials to gauge my speed ???

HELP :?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:31 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:42 am
Posts: 2363
Keep on with the club rides, just try and hang on longer each time. That'll help.

Away from that, if your weakness is climbing, go and do lots of it, practice, push yourself. Find a ride with a nice hill in it and time yourself up the hill section once a week/fortnight. Can also do drills, high cadence and high load type stuff, that'll help with climbing. TBH, strength isn't likely to be the issue, even the fastest sprinters in the world are only pushing on the pedals about as hard as a normal person would climbing the stairs, they are just doing it 200+ times a minute. That's what takes the practice. Pedaling continuously at 80-100 rpm, up hill and down dale......

Also, check bike fit, gearing is one thing, but having a bike that's way too big/long/tall/short/small isn't going to help.

If you were willing to spend 30 or 40 quid on a basic HRM, and something like the cyclists training bible (Joe Friel) you'd be able to see what the basics of training are.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:38 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:55 am
Posts: 2920
Location: Dorset
mattr wrote:
Keep on with the club rides, just try and hang on longer each time. That'll help.

Away from that, if your weakness is climbing, go and do lots of it, practice, push yourself. Find a ride with a nice hill in it and time yourself up the hill section once a week/fortnight. Can also do drills, high cadence and high load type stuff, that'll help with climbing. TBH, strength isn't likely to be the issue, even the fastest sprinters in the world are only pushing on the pedals about as hard as a normal person would climbing the stairs, they are just doing it 200+ times a minute. That's what takes the practice. Pedaling continuously at 80-100 rpm, up hill and down dale......

Also, check bike fit, gearing is one thing, but having a bike that's way too big/long/tall/short/small isn't going to help.

If you were willing to spend 30 or 40 quid on a basic HRM, and something like the cyclists training bible (Joe Friel) you'd be able to see what the basics of training are.



Thankyou, some helpful advice there. The training rides for beginners are once a month so I have a good few weeks before the next one. Its also a vicious circle, once you get dropped of the group you can 'rest' behind the rider in fronts wheel :oops:

I have been keeping a log of my rides, effort, route, average, etc and am going out this morning to try and find a route with a hill that I can time break down into section and time myself. Not sure how long the route should be though ??


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:45 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:42 am
Posts: 2363
widowmaker wrote:
I have been keeping a log of my rides, effort, route, average, etc and am going out this morning to try and find a route with a hill that I can time break down into section and time myself. Not sure how long the route should be though ??
Long enough to get warmed up by the climb and tire you out by the end, but not so long that it breaks you. Look at something about, um, 20-25 miles?
My "basic" training rides at the moment, that i nip out after work or first thing on a weekend are about 30 miles, with three reasonable climbs. So i'm nicely warmed up, but still fresh when i hit the bigger climb (it's only a couple of km at 10%, but climbing it at ~20kph hurts enough with the weight i'm carrying!)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:50 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:55 am
Posts: 2920
Location: Dorset
Thanks, once the heavy rain stops ill be off out and do some route planning 8)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:03 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:42 am
Posts: 2363
widowmaker wrote:
The training rides for beginners are once a month so I have a good few weeks before the next one.
Just noticed this bit...... Either get on the clubs facebook page or forum (if they have one) and try and hook up with some of the other beginners (or non-beginners on their easy/rest days!) and ride with them other times. Training on your own, all the time, as a beginner is very tricky. Its difficult to judge effort or fitness, improvements may or may not actually exist.......
If its a half way decent club they will also have midweek rides, chain gangs (maybe for later!) and evening timetrials (good way of judging fitness, if nothing else!).
My current club has 9 or 10 rides a week during the summer, 3 or 4 weekend road groups and 1 mtb ride, two mtb evening rides, and two evening road rides.......
You are BOUND to get a few out if you post up a "steady 30 miles" ride once a week.

Also, starting at this end of the season is a double edged sword, the race season has all but finished so the racers will be easing off on the training miles and doing more cafe stops (woohoo) but the evening activities/rides will be getting less regular, except for the hard core of riders like the CX riders and elites, first cat etc. Which will hurt!


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 6:20 pm 
retrobike rider
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Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 6840
Location: Nth Somerset, UK
I know you are not there yet, but Cycling Past 50 by Joe Friel has a lot of good training notes, as does The Time Crunched Cyclist by Chris Carmichael and Jim Rutberg.

I've been riding road for less than a year after many years of on and off mtb riding (along side 30 years of Martial Arts) and would say a cheap HRM is worth it's weight as it really gives you a measure of what's going on, even when you are puffing like a train.

In my case I seem to start puffing and blowing early on, I have always done this, even when I was a 22 year old Kendoka. The HRM has allowed me to understand that this is just my breathing pattern, and at times when I think I am working hard, my heart rate says I'm only working moderately, and so I can keep pushing ( dammit).

Initially I broke my training into distance / stamina rides and hill climbing / muscle burning / soul destroying rides. As I got less pathetic at each, I combined them and found a route of about 25 miles, with around 1500 ft of climbing that damn near killed me the first time I rode it. Never the less, I rode it, all of it, without a stop, walk or push. As I have become stronger and more confident (I find a lot of hill climbing is in the head), that ride has become faster and a lot less trouble. so I now seek out more challenging rides.

Just try to balance things out and pushing yourself bit by bit.

I don't do any club rides, but there are a few RB members who do and who have really benefited. I think (just like the MA's) sometimes it is a matter of finding the right club.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:50 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:55 am
Posts: 2920
Location: Dorset
NeilM wrote:
I know you are not there yet, but Cycling Past 50 by Joe Friel has a lot of good training notes, as does The Time Crunched Cyclist by Chris Carmichael and Jim Rutberg.

I've been riding road for less than a year after many years of on and off mtb riding (along side 30 years of Martial Arts) and would say a cheap HRM is worth it's weight as it really gives you a measure of what's going on, even when you are puffing like a train.

In my case I seem to start puffing and blowing early on, I have always done this, even when I was a 22 year old Kendoka. The HRM has allowed me to understand that this is just my breathing pattern, and at times when I think I am working hard, my heart rate says I'm only working moderately, and so I can keep pushing ( dammit).

Initially I broke my training into distance / stamina rides and hill climbing / muscle burning / soul destroying rides. As I got less pathetic at each, I combined them and found a route of about 25 miles, with around 1500 ft of climbing that damn near killed me the first time I rode it. Never the less, I rode it, all of it, without a stop, walk or push. As I have become stronger and more confident (I find a lot of hill climbing is in the head), that ride has become faster and a lot less trouble. so I now seek out more challenging rides.

Just try to balance things out and pushing yourself bit by bit.

I don't do any club rides, but there are a few RB members who do and who have really benefited. I think (just like the MA's) sometimes it is a matter of finding the right club.


A great help - Thanks :)


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:40 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 5:17 pm
Posts: 3775
Location: Norn Iron
Can anyone explain the benefits of Strava or map my ride or similar - and are these useful for training? Can they be combined with the HRM?

This modern stuff is very confusing and i am pondering buying an iPhone or similar - any advice on that or should i look for a Garmin type device?

There is a lot to be said for books!!!

Richard


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:40 pm 
retrobike rider
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Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:08 am
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Location: Nth Somerset, UK
TGR wrote:
Can anyone explain the benefits of Strava or map my ride or similar - and are these useful for training? Can they be combined with the HRM?

This modern stuff is very confusing and i am pondering buying an iPhone or similar - any advice on that or should i look for a Garmin type device?

There is a lot to be said for books!!!

Richard


I use a Garmin to log my rides, HR, cadence, ave speed, ave power and time. I store all this on Strava and also on Garmin's own site. It is all private, so only invited people can share the data, and I use it to analyse my progress.

So far I have seen my ave power slowly go up, my ave HR coming down, my ave speeds going up, although a lot depends on conditions, as riding into a strong headwind will bring you ave speeds down. I have combined this knowledge with my riding experience of certain training routes, noting that killer climbs are now not quite so killer, or as my son puts it "they don't get easier, they just get faster".

I started out with a Garmin Edge 305, as I wanted to see altitude as well as all the other stuff. I have just upgraded to a Garmin 500 and sold the 305. My son also has a 500 which he bought after selling his 700, which had a lot of functions he never used. iPhones and others can run apps that give you an awful lot of the same route data, but I'm not sure if they can interface to HR straps and cadence or power meters. I guess if everything was running Bluetooth, it wouldn't be a problem.

I am not a data junkie, but it's nice to have a few figures that show you are moving in the right direction (pun intended).


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