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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:45 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:38 pm
Posts: 1831
Location: Lovely Lincolnshire Wolds & W. Sussex on the beach.
Not so sure it's off topic, after all discussions sometimes wander. OK the topic is Froome primarily but obviously in discussing Froome a discussion of Team Sky is hard to avoid.

Prior to Froome joining Team Sky he was an unknown and had a very average Palmares even by African standards. As the Greeks say, the fish always stinks from the head down.

J.


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:13 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:16 pm
Posts: 5199
pigman wrote:
al-onestare wrote:
In a competitive sport though, in my view at least, as soon as you start improving personal performance by non-natural (is that the right term?) means, to gain an unfair advantage over a competitor, even if the whole competition is doing it, doesn't make it right and is cheating.

that's where you miss my point. it's not always about gaining an advantage. sometimes it's about surviving. Read the Kimmage book if you get a chance. He so much wanted not to cross that line, but the demands of the sport were such that without he'd have failed ... then been unemployed etc etc. It didn't help that the majority of everyone else was charged-up, so he if anything, he levelled with them. He was never interested in gaining an advantage over competitors.

I'll try and give an analogy (but the context is much different).
Imagine you and other colleagues do the same job. You are committed to ecological issues and therefore do not own a car. This means you have a long, strenuous walk at the beginning and end of day. The others all drive. As the days, weeks, months go on, you sense you are underperforming compared to the others and conclude that all the walking is taking its toll. Do you buy a car to ease the burden, keep up and safeguard your job, but at the same time become unethical or do you tough it out until stress/ill health/unemployment manifest themselves? Do you see the purchase of a car in this example as something to gain an unfair advantage? [rhetorical questions!]

anyway, this is getting off topic, as Team Sky are a essentially a winning machine, not a team surviving


For every Kimmage, there's a Bassons; I'm guessing you've read that one.

I get where you're coming from and I see your point. For me, it's unethical full stop, regardless if the majority are at it. I totally understand why some folks were torn (Kimmage) and I respect those that question it and take action - even if it means changing their life for the worse (short/medium-term).

Back to the subject in hand, still no news from the UCI and le Tour starts next week :facepalm:


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:19 pm 
GOLD | PoTM | Rider | rBOTM
GOLD | PoTM | Rider | rBOTM
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 6:26 pm
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Location: 54 Festive Road Winchcombe GLOUCS Yarp...
As with football and red cards, it seem that some are bigger than the sport.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:36 pm 
r.B.o.T.M. & P.o.T.M. Winner
r.B.o.T.M. & P.o.T.M. Winner
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Well now ain't we all a bunch of shit kickers all got something to say but saying nothing, innocent until proven guilty not by some of the members on retro bike you're not FFS


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:44 am 
GOLD | PoTM | Rider | rBOTM
GOLD | PoTM | Rider | rBOTM
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Location: 54 Festive Road Winchcombe GLOUCS Yarp...
Yes we are, if that's the terminology you wish to employ. You included.

It seems that some have an issue with freely and appropriately expressed opinions. As was said on the first page, let's not let this descend etc .......


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 11:44 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2361
Location: Sheffield, top city
kingbling wrote:
Well now ain't we all a bunch of shit kickers all got something to say but saying nothing, innocent until proven guilty not by some of the members on retro bike you're not FFS

someone translate please.... maybe not, if it leads to a warzone


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