Retro is Right

Righto,

I've undertaken a little exercise on behalf of us Retrobikers.

I've run the same 20mile course above Margam on my 99 Explosif with Z2 Bombers, and a 2010 Orange 5 Pro. I know the area very well, so can give it full wellie at all times. I used a GPS to log the route on both rides, to compare the uphills/downhills, and overall performance. I was pushing as hard as I could on both bikes.

Findings are my personal views, and I have no doubt that others will find things different.

1. Uphills. O5 was surprisingly sprightly. Nearly matching the Kona despite the extra weight and bounce. Pro pedal was used.

2. Downhill. Fireroads - Kona quicker. Rocky sections - Kona quicker (possibly due to my knowledge of lines?).

3. Kona was around 5% quicker on the whole route.

4. My left hand was significantly more painful on the Kona (V brakes),

5. My back and shoulders were less sore after the O5 ride (noticeably so),

Conclusions:

I found the O5 ride almost "lazy". The Kona ride is far more visceral, exciting and feels quicker. The turn of pace over crests etc, is staggering compared to the O5.

Now, I know that the Kona rides better with my 100mm REBA Teams, so should be quicker still on that course. I'll let you know when they are back from repair, and I can run a comparison.

I think that the O5 would be faster over rocky/rooty DH, in normal circumstances.

I wish the Kona had rear disk tabs!!!!!

The O5 costs £2500!!!!!

God the O5 is ugly. It's like riding a mattress.

Buy an old Kona.

(Actually buy both. They are both superb).

Interesting comparison.
Isn't using GPS a little too *modern* though?
I would've thought it more appropriate to use a stopwatch and a map instead...

This is the only part I find suprising:

ratbane":2ejsjhcy said:

Rocky sections - Kona quicker (possibly due to my knowledge of lines?).

Click to expand...

Did you follow the same lines on the Five? If you are having to be nimble to follow the same line then it makes sense. Or, was it quicker to pick a line on the Kona than crash through on the Five?

Your summary of the Five feeling lazy reinforces what I see as the purpose of a bike like that. It's to take anywhere, do anything, all day then go do it again tomorrow. The Explosif is a thoroughbred race whippet; it'll get you from A to B fast, but I wouldn't choose it for an epic or want to ride it hard two days in a row.

I love the nostalgia of a one off ride on an old steel bike. But if I was riding seriously and regularly I'd want the comfort and versatility that something like a Five gives.

good test. That bike is 'space hopper orange'

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drystonepaul":n4t9s7ix said:

Interesting comparison.
Isn't using GPS a little too *modern* though?
I would've thought it more appropriate to use a stopwatch and a map instead...

Click to expand...

It's not MY GPS ok!!!

I didn't fancy pacing it out after.

Tallpaul":18koaxcx said:

This is the only part I find suprising:

ratbane":18koaxcx said:

Rocky sections - Kona quicker (possibly due to my knowledge of lines?).

Click to expand...

Did you follow the same lines on the Five? If you are having to be nimble to follow the same line then it makes sense. Or, was it quicker to pick a line on the Kona than crash through on the Five?

Your summary of the Five feeling lazy reinforces what I see as the purpose of a bike like that. It's to take anywhere, do anything, all day then go do it again tomorrow. The Explosif is a thoroughbred race whippet; it'll get you from A to B fast, but I wouldn't choose it for an epic or want to ride it hard two days in a row.

I love the nostalgia of a one off ride on an old steel bike. But if I was riding seriously and regularly I'd want the comfort and versatility that something like a Five gives.

Click to expand...

I think that subliminally I chose lines on the Kona which I know work for a hardtail. Using a hardtail makes you look for lines I reckon, whereas the FS option allows you to let the bike suck up the hits.

I think you are spot-on with the intended uses. However, I'm not sure that people buy FS bikes for all day work in general. A full day on the Explosif in that terrain gets more painful as you get older too.

I seriously don't think you need 5" of travel for most uses.

A stewards inquiry!

I believe extra cake was consumed during the Kona run.

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legrandefromage":22hxlia8 said:

A stewards inquiry!

I believe extra cake was consumed during the Kona run.

Click to expand...

It was quite a bit wetter during the O5 ride too!

I reckon the laziness of the O5 would actually allow you to eat cake, whilst riding full tilt - hands off. Couldn't do that on the Kona.

ratbane":16uazdxg said:

I seriously don't think you need 5" of travel for most uses.

Click to expand...

When platformed damped shocks offer comparable performance to a hard-tail when climbing, what disadvantage do they have?

A bike that is within 5% of one built purely for speed, but that offers options beyond the capabilities of a hard-tail and is comfortable? For me, this defines what every serious recreational mountain biker should want from their ride.

For the frequency and intensity of riding I do, a hardtail is all I need (i.e. can justify paying for). If I had more time and access to some hills, I'd sell 'em all for a Five

Tallpaul":r969avge said:

ratbane":r969avge said:

I seriously don't think you need 5" of travel for most uses.

Click to expand...

When platformed damped shocks offer comparable performance to a hard-tail when climbing, what disadvantage do they have?

A bike that is within 5% of one built purely for speed, but that offers options beyond the capabilities of a hard-tail and is comfortable? For me, this defines what every serious recreational mountain biker should want from their ride.

For the frequency and intensity of riding I do, a hardtail is all I need (i.e. can justify paying for). If I had more time and access to some hills, I'd sell 'em all for a Five

Click to expand...

It all feels just a bit lardy really. There's no doubt that the modern (higher end) FS bikes climb well in comparison to a hardatil, but it's the overall feel that lacks what I look for in a mountain bike. You feel slightly removed from the track.

It's also very expensive.

I think this desire for 5" is driven by the bike magazines. Now a lighter FS such as an Anthem/ST4 type rig may be a different matter. When you get to 5", the frames are so beefed up that they don't move around too quickly underneath you.