frame identity

hi all

i have frame that was re enameled 30 years ago and in doing so has lost its identity,
i was wondering if anyone had any idea what it could be.
its got a heart engraved on the outside of the fork lugs and a line of card symbols( hearts/ spades etc)
engraved to the inside. it also had some top components on the actual bike/ record/ zeus/ gb engaved bars and nervex lugs, so im guessing it was a decent frame.
ive attached some pics, if anyone could help me that would be great,

thanks

mark

What does the seat cluster look like? If it has wrap around stays, it looks very much like a Carlton of some kind

ill take a couple more pics tonight, see what you think?

de rosa had hearts

but idk if that helps any cause idrk what it is

hi there what do you mean by idrk/idk? thanks

catboy1981":110tiiyf said:

hi there what do you mean by idrk/idk? thanks

Click to expand...

IDK = i dont know
IDRK - i dont really know
are my guesses.

Back to frame.
You say there are a number of card features. as someone says, Derosa had hearts. Well colnago has clubs. I guess the framebuilder played on these style touches.
Lugs and over bottom bracket cable guides suggest pre 1980's. After this, under bracket tunnels and short dropouts became common. Initially, I thought cycloX frame, but in that age, they had single chainwheels, so no front mech guide would be fitted. Plus there are mudguard eyes, so I would say it was a tourer. Italian bikes tended to be racers, not tourers.

If I were guessing, I'd say it was a club bike/tourer from a bespoke framebuilder, evidenced by quality lugwork and probably British cos at that time, we were the best at it.

But its all guesswork.

the guy i bought it off had stored it for 30 years and its was re enameled in the 70s, i thought it might be british just because of the style of lugs, people have mentioned it could be a briggs but im not sure, theres no reference of heart in their framework.

I would put it at a 70's frame because of the cable guides and long rear dropouts. 60's would be cable stops either side of the bracket, 80's underneath. Nervex Professional lugs as well, nice.

Where in the country does it originate from? This might be a guide to its parentage.

Any numbers anywhere?

hi thanks for the info ive put the frame up for sale, theres some more info and pics + serial number

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=65390