Tushingham Resource Pool
- Thread starter mrkawasaki
- Start date
Hi and sorry i've not seen this site before. Just looking for info on my Tushingham B52 on google, which was stolen off the back of my car yesterday. I didn't realise what I have been riding for the past 25yrs was such a classic. It was in great nick and I'm keen to find it. If anyone comes across one for sale with new continental tyres and in original condition please let me know. It had the main shimano oval crank replaced with a campagnolo one around 15 yrs ago and was last seen near South Normanton in Derbyshire. Good luck with the rebuild, BTW its a B52 you have for sure if I'm not mistaken.
Re:
Just been reading through this thread as I picked up a Tushingham B52 the other day
...
Looks to be original, Exage Mountain groupset, the lady who sold the bike did say that she used to sail with Roger & Lester bitd and bought the bike when Tushingham started selling them, but bought a Clockwork when they first came out as they were lighter, hence the Tushingham was left hanging up in her garage, lucky for me!
Just been reading through this thread as I picked up a Tushingham B52 the other day
...
Looks to be original, Exage Mountain groupset, the lady who sold the bike did say that she used to sail with Roger & Lester bitd and bought the bike when Tushingham started selling them, but bought a Clockwork when they first came out as they were lighter, hence the Tushingham was left hanging up in her garage, lucky for me!
Re:
Firstly; sorry for the necromancy.
Secondly; does anyone know what brand/model of stem the B52s have? Would really quite like one for my B52-in-disguise. I found a close approximation (a Sakae stem with a roller), but I don't think it's quite right. Looks nice, tho, so I can live with it.
Thirdly; here's my contribution to this rather old (but ace) thread; another Muddy Fox branded B52 frame:
It's got the seatstay-mounted U brake, the dual downtube bottle mounts, and had a mostly Exage Mountain groupset (apart from the bits replaced by the previous owner). The parts were so broken that I had to replace most of it - the only original components are the U brake, the front mech, the seat QR, and the headset.
Here's that stem I mentioned:
Firstly; sorry for the necromancy.
Secondly; does anyone know what brand/model of stem the B52s have? Would really quite like one for my B52-in-disguise. I found a close approximation (a Sakae stem with a roller), but I don't think it's quite right. Looks nice, tho, so I can live with it.
Thirdly; here's my contribution to this rather old (but ace) thread; another Muddy Fox branded B52 frame:
It's got the seatstay-mounted U brake, the dual downtube bottle mounts, and had a mostly Exage Mountain groupset (apart from the bits replaced by the previous owner). The parts were so broken that I had to replace most of it - the only original components are the U brake, the front mech, the seat QR, and the headset.
Here's that stem I mentioned:
Have just come across this site, and was wondering for many years why I hadn't seen any muddyfox red couriers like mine around. Didn't realise it was such a classic rare bike. Bought it new for my 16th in 1989 and still have in completely original condition and still ride it. I'll upload some pictures as I think it will answer some peoples questions about original colours of some parts etc. only just last year changed the tyres off(muddyfox dirttrax) as they were starting to perish. Nice to know some are still around and I had no idea of the tushingham tie up
I've copied this across from my build thread. to try and keep as much info as possible in one thread.
I thought I would throw up some notes I made on the frames when I started with this project for anyone that may be interested,
I've pulled this together from looking a what little photos there seems to be of Tushinghams, as more info. comes to light I'll add it in somewhere.
All is from photos of surviving examples, I've not seen a restored Tushingham (other than mine)...are there any others?
General information.
All Tushingham were Fluorescent Orange (Standard colour RAL 2005) over Pearlised White (Muddyfox colour), according to the sales sheet they were Diamond White, however all the frames I have seen are Pearlised White.
Headtube, downtube, BB lugging and approx. 1/3rd of the seat tube/chainstay are Fluro Orange, paint fade demarcation varies between individual frames.
Early models all appear to be badged as ‘Tushingham’, although those more knowledgeable than I state it was always going to be called a B.52...more later on this...later models are badged as ‘Tushingham B-52'...there are also late frame models badged as Tushigham only!
The original B.52 sales brochure from Rodger Tushingham via Sinnerman showing a complete lugged frame does not show the B.52 decal.
The brochure also states ‘Fully lugged frame’ of which some later versions are clearly not fully lugged.
There are two styles of ‘Tushingham’ decal, an outline type in blue seen on early models which do not carry the B.52 script, and a blocked in full colour type, blue centre with orange border, seen on later model frames which also have the B.52 script which is solid blue in a different font.
Head tube and seat tube badges are identical across models.
Tubing decals vary depending on the tubing used in construction..my lighter tubing frame is heavier than the cheap tubing frame! (Same frame size).
To try and make sense of the Tushingham frame timeline, I’ve decided to simply identify them as Early and Late frames, anyone with a more scientific method please chime in!
Early Tushingham
Early – Fully Lugged construction using Tange Cr-Mo MTB PG (Plain gauge) Tubing, there are also some using Tange Cr-Mo Triple Butted MTB tubing. I have seen photos of an original survivor, lugged construction, U-brake etc with the blue/yellow Tange Triple butted decal.
Chain stay mounted U-Brake.
Single water bottle boss mounts on the lower section of the down tube.
Seat stays brazed to the lateral aspect of the Seat tube lug.
Triple cable run boss to the downtube.
Upper and lower mud guard attachment boss.
Cast (Muddyfox/Araya type) stem with roller, also seen with the tubular welded stem.
Later Tushigham.
Late - Some fully lugged, others not.
Tange blue/black & yellow tubing decal - Tange Cr-Mo MTB Triple butted tubing.
Seat stays entering into the lug below the centreline of the Toptube.
Seat stay mounted U-brake/Cantilevers.
Narrow welded tubular stem with cable roller.
Double water bottle boss on down tube.
Single cable run boss to top tube.
Double cable boss to downtube.
No upper mudguard attachment boss, others with mudguard bosses.
Later frame with Seatstays brazed into the Seat lug.
The ‘Odd’ ones…
The one Orange have which is claimed to be a B52 prototype at their factory has some features that did not make it onto the later frames, the seatstays finish higher on the lug than production frames, the seatstays have cross bracing (seen on the Works replica frames), it does not carry the B52 script.
Question is if this is a prototype, then it must be a prototype development from the earlier frames to a more modern approach (Seat stay mounted brake) and not a prototype of the original first Tushingham frames which had Chainstay mounted brakes.
Orange prototype with the high brazed seatstays, rear cross bracing, odd fork and no B.52 decal.
I have seen at least one example (magazine advertisement photo) badged as a Tushingham B-52 with the early lateral seat stays, a lugged seat/top tube and Head tube lug only with the a single cable run on the Top tube. Narrow welded stem with roller. This also carries the yellow/blue Tange decal. Perhaps a transition frame between fully lugged and non-lugged filet brazed?
A note on tubing decals...
Blue/purple & blue/yellow Tange PG/Triple butted tubing decals do not appear in the 1988 Tange tubing/Frame brochure.
My Tushingham decals were not lacquered over, the Tubing decal was above the lacquer.
My Tushingham B.52 decals were lacquered over, the tubing decal was again not lacquered over.
Stems appear to have changed from the early cast Muddyfox/Araya type with roller, to a welded tubular type with roller during production run.
Research - in the process of restoring my Early Tushigham I wrote to Roger Tushingham to ask a few questions, sadly there was no reply from him.
I wrote to Dave Yates concerning the Works Replica's he was to custom build - he has no records that far back, nor does he recall how many he may have built.
hope this is of some use.
Andy
I thought I would throw up some notes I made on the frames when I started with this project for anyone that may be interested,
I've pulled this together from looking a what little photos there seems to be of Tushinghams, as more info. comes to light I'll add it in somewhere.
All is from photos of surviving examples, I've not seen a restored Tushingham (other than mine)...are there any others?
General information.
All Tushingham were Fluorescent Orange (Standard colour RAL 2005) over Pearlised White (Muddyfox colour), according to the sales sheet they were Diamond White, however all the frames I have seen are Pearlised White.
Headtube, downtube, BB lugging and approx. 1/3rd of the seat tube/chainstay are Fluro Orange, paint fade demarcation varies between individual frames.
Early models all appear to be badged as ‘Tushingham’, although those more knowledgeable than I state it was always going to be called a B.52...more later on this...later models are badged as ‘Tushingham B-52'...there are also late frame models badged as Tushigham only!
The original B.52 sales brochure from Rodger Tushingham via Sinnerman showing a complete lugged frame does not show the B.52 decal.
The brochure also states ‘Fully lugged frame’ of which some later versions are clearly not fully lugged.
There are two styles of ‘Tushingham’ decal, an outline type in blue seen on early models which do not carry the B.52 script, and a blocked in full colour type, blue centre with orange border, seen on later model frames which also have the B.52 script which is solid blue in a different font.
Head tube and seat tube badges are identical across models.
Tubing decals vary depending on the tubing used in construction..my lighter tubing frame is heavier than the cheap tubing frame! (Same frame size).
To try and make sense of the Tushingham frame timeline, I’ve decided to simply identify them as Early and Late frames, anyone with a more scientific method please chime in!
Early Tushingham
Early – Fully Lugged construction using Tange Cr-Mo MTB PG (Plain gauge) Tubing, there are also some using Tange Cr-Mo Triple Butted MTB tubing. I have seen photos of an original survivor, lugged construction, U-brake etc with the blue/yellow Tange Triple butted decal.
Chain stay mounted U-Brake.
Single water bottle boss mounts on the lower section of the down tube.
Seat stays brazed to the lateral aspect of the Seat tube lug.
Triple cable run boss to the downtube.
Upper and lower mud guard attachment boss.
Cast (Muddyfox/Araya type) stem with roller, also seen with the tubular welded stem.
Later Tushigham.
Late - Some fully lugged, others not.
Tange blue/black & yellow tubing decal - Tange Cr-Mo MTB Triple butted tubing.
Seat stays entering into the lug below the centreline of the Toptube.
Seat stay mounted U-brake/Cantilevers.
Narrow welded tubular stem with cable roller.
Double water bottle boss on down tube.
Single cable run boss to top tube.
Double cable boss to downtube.
No upper mudguard attachment boss, others with mudguard bosses.
Later frame with Seatstays brazed into the Seat lug.
The ‘Odd’ ones…
The one Orange have which is claimed to be a B52 prototype at their factory has some features that did not make it onto the later frames, the seatstays finish higher on the lug than production frames, the seatstays have cross bracing (seen on the Works replica frames), it does not carry the B52 script.
Question is if this is a prototype, then it must be a prototype development from the earlier frames to a more modern approach (Seat stay mounted brake) and not a prototype of the original first Tushingham frames which had Chainstay mounted brakes.
Orange prototype with the high brazed seatstays, rear cross bracing, odd fork and no B.52 decal.
I have seen at least one example (magazine advertisement photo) badged as a Tushingham B-52 with the early lateral seat stays, a lugged seat/top tube and Head tube lug only with the a single cable run on the Top tube. Narrow welded stem with roller. This also carries the yellow/blue Tange decal. Perhaps a transition frame between fully lugged and non-lugged filet brazed?
A note on tubing decals...
Blue/purple & blue/yellow Tange PG/Triple butted tubing decals do not appear in the 1988 Tange tubing/Frame brochure.
My Tushingham decals were not lacquered over, the Tubing decal was above the lacquer.
My Tushingham B.52 decals were lacquered over, the tubing decal was again not lacquered over.
Stems appear to have changed from the early cast Muddyfox/Araya type with roller, to a welded tubular type with roller during production run.
Research - in the process of restoring my Early Tushigham I wrote to Roger Tushingham to ask a few questions, sadly there was no reply from him.
I wrote to Dave Yates concerning the Works Replica's he was to custom build - he has no records that far back, nor does he recall how many he may have built.
hope this is of some use.
Andy
As an after thought, I thought it may be worth while to maintain a log of known Tushingham Serial numbers.
If member would like to add their bike serial to the listing please do.
Somewhere down the line someone will need this when 'us oldies' are gone and our kids have sold the bikes to fund the latest gimmick/gadget!
This is what I know of so far, I've not identified who had or has what bike or frame.
I've included the Red Couriers as these are directly related to Tushingham production.
Red Muddyfox Courier.
H8G81803
Early Tushingham Frame (Single Bottle Mounts, Chain stay brake mount)
TH87 10 ?38244
H7N05291
Late Tushingham B52 Frame (Double Bottle Mount, Seat stay brake mount)
H8C33175
H8C33612
Andy
Edit Jan. 2022 - Corrected the Early serial number.
If member would like to add their bike serial to the listing please do.
Somewhere down the line someone will need this when 'us oldies' are gone and our kids have sold the bikes to fund the latest gimmick/gadget!
This is what I know of so far, I've not identified who had or has what bike or frame.
I've included the Red Couriers as these are directly related to Tushingham production.
Red Muddyfox Courier.
H8G81803
Early Tushingham Frame (Single Bottle Mounts, Chain stay brake mount)
TH87 10 ?38244
H7N05291
Late Tushingham B52 Frame (Double Bottle Mount, Seat stay brake mount)
H8C33175
H8C33612
Andy
Edit Jan. 2022 - Corrected the Early serial number.
Last edited:
agentorange
rBotM Winner
Re:
Stumbled accross this auction a while ago and noticed some very strange features to what I guess is being ignorantly sold as an 'old Orange'.
Upon closer inspection you will notice the 'formula'-esque geometry and the odd cable routing. Then I noticed that there was no sign of a model with 'Orange' on every tube. Then the rear seat stay bridge/U-brake reminded me of this old Tushingham thread.
I can't really see where this bike slots into the history but there's clearly more here than an early Clockwork/Prestige.
Would be good to get the experts thoughts.
Here are the pics from the auction which hoepefully will remain live once the auction has expired.
Stumbled accross this auction a while ago and noticed some very strange features to what I guess is being ignorantly sold as an 'old Orange'.
Upon closer inspection you will notice the 'formula'-esque geometry and the odd cable routing. Then I noticed that there was no sign of a model with 'Orange' on every tube. Then the rear seat stay bridge/U-brake reminded me of this old Tushingham thread.
I can't really see where this bike slots into the history but there's clearly more here than an early Clockwork/Prestige.
Would be good to get the experts thoughts.
Here are the pics from the auction which hoepefully will remain live once the auction has expired.
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