How do modern XC hardtails compare with retrobikes?

Is there a comparable difference between the retro race specced xc bikes and the current race spec xc bikes?

sadly, the modern hardtail is becoming a 29er. some of which handle OK, but many of which simply feel like a fast rolling tool with very little rider feedback and engagement.

my (probably now retro) 2007 8500 Trek Hardtail rides like an absolute dream compared to any retro bike i have ever owned.

Most modern hardtail I've tried is a kona chute and agree that the bars aroundbyour ears thing feels really weird. Not sure I like. Happier with the riding position on mt Zaskar.

Ruffnek":3aymvwtp said:

Is there a comparable difference between the retro race specced xc bikes and the current race spec xc bikes?

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Not really. My mid/late 90s Ti XC HTs are both very similar to ride to my "still available in the shops" Carbon XC HT which is what i went to when the 90's got retired.

Top tube is a bit longer, stem is a bit shorter, but then, a zaskar TT was ~15mm longer than my Ti, so no surprise there, and there is an extra 30 odd mm of travel up front. There is also half a degree on the head angle, but the suspension actually works on the new bike, and it sits further into the travel, so its not that noticeable (nice active air/oil forks are so much better than elastomer!)

Thing is, back in the 90s, almost all HTs were fairly racy, there wasn't this "do it all" hardcore HT bracket, people just put short stems and wide bars on their XC HT frame. And tried to break them. Probably explains the rarity of the Zaskar!

I had a go on a ridgeback 2013 model hydroformed blah blah, it was very nice. then I got back on my fisher. that was very nice but in a way that I felt like 25 years ago. now i take the fisher and feel like I have bottled my youth.

I'm confuzzled by all the different ghettos MTB have been lumped in whilst I've not been paying attention.

What's the difference between Trail and XC? Is the first closest to a "do it all" fire road to woodland tracks type pootling bike and the second more of a race/trail Center beasty?

The cynical would reply 'Its 20 years of trying to market the same thing over and over again with a tweek to an oil bath here or a new paint scheme there'

The cynical mind you...

secret_squirrel":2f2uurwb said:

I'm confuzzled by all the different ghettos MTB have been lumped in whilst I've not been paying attention.

What's the difference between Trail and XC? Is the first closest to a "do it all" fire road to woodland tracks type pootling bike and the second more of a race/trail Center beasty?

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My take on this would be that an XC bike has the emphasis on lightness, and would have a more modest (by todays standard!) 100mm fork, while a trail bike would have a bit more travel and a slightly more relaxed geometry.
LGF is correct though, it's mainly marketing bollox!!

Ruffnek":26gscked said:

Is there a comparable difference between the retro race specced xc bikes and the current race spec xc bikes?

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I'd say there's quite a few differences. This is the bike Jaroslav Kulhavy rode to Olympic gold -

Fudd":24deq28n said:

I'd say there's quite a few differences. This is the bike Jaroslav Kulhavy rode to Olympic gold

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Odd looking hardtail.