Snowdon or bust: Retrobike Raid - Poll added...

Official Retrobike raid on Snowdon viability?

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drystonepaul":1ha1scpe said:
Rob Atkin":1ha1scpe said:
Well if Snowden is a poor choice then the Peaks should be a no-no too - much higher density of walkers than anywhere in Snowdonia, especially Mam Tor/Edale area. Isn't it still the busiest National Park in the UK?

Even with 10-15 riders (which I think we would struggle to get for such a ride) it'd be fine - we would be outside the peak time for walkers anyway (that's the whole point of the voluntary ban). In fact I think it'd be quite an event!

As far as I am aware though Rob, there isn't anywhere in the Peaks which is subject to an official voluntary ban.
The land owners and manager's around Snowdon are in a much stronger position should they wish to apply for a permanent ban on bikes using the BWs due to already having the voluntary ban in place.

But we aren't breaking the ban so that's a problem that doesn't even exist!

I think you're worrying too much about it. Thousands of people going up every day, we would be on a legal bridle way, respecting the voluntary ban. 15 of us (a pretty small group - ive seen groups of triple that walking up!!) would present no problem whatsoever. In fact I don't think we'd even be noticed. If it was a nice evening we'd probably be amongst more MTBers than walkers anyway.
 
Sheesh!

My concerns have got nothing to do with how big groups of walkers are, or how many people can get the train up. It's got nothing to do with self discrimination either, rather instead a bit of self moderation.

It's due to the fact that, in the past, there have been problems with mountain bikers descending at speed amongst walkers on the rights of ways on Snowdon. I'm sure that there are still incidents on such a busy route. But the voluntary ban, and a largely sensible and compliant community of mountain bikers, positively manage and limit this risk.

The point that I you seem to be missing is that a big group of bikers, no matter what their age, intent or good will does not suddenly erase that history. The very fact that it's a large group of bikers will draw attention to the fact that it's a large group of bikers.
It only takes one person to make a complaint, or one collision to potentially jeopardise what is still quite a fragile access agreement.

The ban is designed to be of advantage to walkers and bikers as it limits the potential for trail user conflict.
Riding in smaller groups also limits the potential for trail user conflict, at any time of day or year.

So in short, to organise a big group ride somewhere as potentially sensitive as Snowdon would, in my opinion be unwise.

But, by all means, if it's a small group then go for it.
 
What would you call a big or small group then? I reckon small is 10-15 and under, big is probably more than that. 15 people stretched out over the very wide bridleway isn't going to attract much attention as the different abilities will string it out. If it was 30+ I'd be worried myself, and personally I think the 50 odd we had at the Peaks was pushing it a bit! ;-)
 
On Snowdon, I'd reckon a big group would be anything over about 8 riders.

56 riders was a very large group on the Peaks ride, which is why we split it in two for some sections, man marked the tricky descents and completely staggered everybody out along the busiest section along the Mam Tor - Hollins Cross ridge.

It took a lot of careful planning behind the scenes to successfully pull that one off.

It was seamless though, so many people may not have noticed.
 
I've just trawled the net and cannot find any issues at all with the voluntary ban, it seems it has been working well for years and there is no hint that a permanent ban is imminently "threatened". I found a quote from a Park Ranger there who said yes, there has been a few people ignoring the ban but they were very few and didn't pose a threat to the good relations or current agreement that stands.

Maybe limit it to 10?
 
Oooooooooooooh-ho no! One has a couple of Aces up ones sleeve...
AnimatedSmileyWinking.gif
 
It's not a ban, it's a voluntary agreement :)

I've done it in November and April. Pretty quiet both times. Going up from Llanberis is slow anyway so not much scope for conflict there. Coming down Rangers we met a couple of people on both occasions. Wouldn't recommend going back down Llanberis path for traffic and Rangers-is-more-interesting reasons.

Just out of agreement season sounds best to me.

Some encouragement:


Snowdon by MikeDavis, on Flickr


Snowdon by MikeDavis, on Flickr


Snowdon by MikeDavis, on Flickr
 
In case anybody's interested, I'll be going to the Snowdon area around 6/7th - 10th April on my 99 Orange Gringo. Nothing set in stone yet, holiday hasn't even been confirmed from work, but I've been told it should be ok.

Off round to my friends tonight to decide on exact details like where to camp etc, but none of them are cyclists so I'll be going up on my own unless anybody off here would care to join me :)
 
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