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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:17 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:30 pm
Posts: 6
Location: London
I've almost completed my first project - the assembly of a 1980's Walvale.
I'm at the wiring up stage and have come across a problem with the friction shifters and gear changes.

The front shifter (left) works ok but the right one keeps returning to its starting position. When I turn the shifter anticlockwise the rear derilleur functions and the chain moves up the cogs but the moment I let go of the shifter it pulls back in line with the downtube and the chain shifts back to the lowest cog.

Any idea what I've done wrong? Can I have too much tension in the cable?
They are Campagnolo C Record Friction Shifters.

Thanks


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:19 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 5:34 pm
Posts: 532
Location: Olissipo-PT
sounds like you're missing a nylon washer in your right shifter...


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:34 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 559
Location: Liverpool
Hi Betty :-) Is that the Walvale off ebay from a few weeks back ? Smallish frame, beautiful lugs ? I was after that because Walvale are A) grossly not known as top frame builders of the 70's -80's and secondly they where my LBS (local bike shop).

If ever you want history on the shop etc, just PM me :-)

Now to the matter in hand. As stated by cymbal, it may well be the plastic insert is mis-aligned / not seated properly / missing. I will assume however you would have noticed this part missing since it has the flat notch in to prevent the lever just slopping all over the place.

I suggest it is not the nylon but a brass spacer / shim that fits on top of the assembly at the end just before you screw it all togther. It is this that applies the correct pressure and stops the lever returning to its un-tensioned position. Without this shim, the screw in doodah that holds it all in place will simply bottom out and not tighten, no matter how much you try to turn it.

I have had this problem twice now when fitting what look like simple levers to a frame that had similar type on, but, in 1 case it was that the stack height of the whole lever was slightly different to the older 1's I took off. In short, "the tightening nut is bottoming out on the brased on gear lever thingy (sorry my brain is half asleep)" Either way, it really sounds like it needs a shim/spacer to allow the tightening nut to actually do its job, and not bottom out before it tightens the levers in place.

I can help with this if you're stuck for that part :-) No charge, just need an address to send to, so PM me if my answer is the solution to your problem and you have lost / misplaced / never had this vital part of C Record GL's. Hope all of this made sense, yours Laz.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:57 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:30 pm
Posts: 6
Location: London
Thank you so much for the rapid responses!

Isn't it a small world - it is indeed the Walvale from ebay and I'm so happy to have won the bid by the skin of my teeth, it's a beautiful bike. Sorry about that though.

I've got a picture here of the campagnolo friction shifter parts and how I assembled them, you have to insert the http:/ bit as I'm not able to post links:

whatapalaver.co.uk/2011/09/assembling-a-campagnolo-frictional-gear-shifter/

The nylon washers are in place and I'm pretty sure I assembled both sides in the same way. Having said that the right side did feel looser than the left but I presumed it might have a slightly different function.

I haven't got a brass washer under the D-Nut though. Do you think I've got my order wrong or is it that I'm missing the final washer?

I'm going to go back to the set up later on and work through your notes so I'll report back.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 4:43 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2010 5:34 pm
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Location: Olissipo-PT
hum.... everything seems in the proper order...

Image

You've tighten the D-ring on the problematic side as hard as on the working side right?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 5:12 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:31 am
Posts: 585
Location: London
If the lever is all there and fitted correctly, the usual reason for it slipping is simply the mounting bolt (the one with the D ring) is not tight enough or it has too much oil.

If it still slips after tightening, take it apart and clean it; wipe off any grease or oil and reassemble.

As mention upthread, the bolt might be bottoming out, but that would be unusual.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:39 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:30 pm
Posts: 6
Location: London
Thanks for re-posting my picture. I could be wrong but after looking at the photo again it appears that the right screw is longer than the left. I'll check it out when I disassemble them both.

I can't tighten the d-nut any further but if the bolt was longer it would support the bottoming out theory.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:31 pm
Posts: 770
It just may be my eyes or... The brass washers on the left. Are they different ways up? They just don't look the same. Would the way in which they face be anything to do with it?


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 240
The Shifters I bought off ebay had sawn off bolts , maybe it is common for the bolt to bottom out in the lever boss before there is enough friction. The bolts should be titanium so shortening them might be hard work :D

Anyhoo, the parts catalogue suggests you've got too many washers and both bolts should be the same ...


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:16 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:31 am
Posts: 585
Location: London
Thanks to the diagram, I think I know what's causing the problem.

There were 2 types of levers.

The levers in the top half of the diagram are the "retro-friction" type, called "Doppler" by Campagnolo. The bottom ones are the plain friction levers.

It looks like the OP's got the plain friction levers fitted with some of the parts meant for the retro-friction levers.

The 2 types of levers work in a different way.

The retro type only has resistance when you push the lever forward, unlike the plain friction levers. So when you pull the RH retro lever back to change to a lower gear (ie to a bigger sprocket), the lever has no friction, you are only pulling against the derailleur spring.

I've got a pair of the Doppler levers but I've always prefer the Simplex Retro-friction levers. The washers marked F and G are not flat (parts 6 in the diagram), they act like a sort of spring, Campagnolo calls them "spring cups".


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