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PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 5:12 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2007 10:40 pm
Posts: 1526
Location: Atherton, Manchester
Dr S wrote:
Now on the other hand..... there is some woodland on the edge of town near the football pitch, a good half mile from anyone, where a group of lads have built some jumps and doubles. The bloody council went up with a Bobcat last week and levelled the lot and put in big trenches to stop them. These lads were doing no harm, keeping out of the way and harming no-one. Yes they will have been drinking and listening to Busted or whetever youth is into these days, but my point is- what is worse, hanging around frightening people and harrassing the cops or getting some air and breaking your own bones every now and then? These guys get my sympathy.


The council probably did that out of fear that if one of the yoofs hurt themselves they would be liable through the "where theres blame theres a claim" brigade as sad it is its killing all the fun.

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:29 pm 
Ain't no party like an S Club party
Ain't no party like an S Club party
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Joined: Thu May 25, 2006 4:54 pm
Posts: 7075
Location: UK
Dr S wrote:
BoyBurning wrote:
It has to be said that the police don't help themselves.

Take a walk round Huyton and all you see sprayed everywhere is "KILL THE MATRIX".

This is because wherever else you look the police are taunting gangs of kids, roughing them up, and performing illegal searches.

Doesn't help win trust...


So these gangs- hanging around underage drinking, vandalising, intimidating people, taking drugs, shouting and generally being a pain in the ass shouldn't be bothered by the cops??S

When I was a kid a group of us used to hang around. We were mates, and I had more than one. A group of mates isn't a problem is it? Not all gangs are trouble. Not all gangs do the crap you mention. That's the problem - all are tarred the same.

It became an issue because the Tories made it illegal to be in a group of however many people (can't remember exactly). This meant the cops started to harass groups of mates because they now had the power to disperse them. People who a day earlier were just mates havin a laugh were now breaking the law.

When we all meet up for a ride there's a few of us. We're a gang. Do we go around doin all the stuff you mention?

That's bollocks I'm afraid Si.

Same reason why all the pubs are closing. Working class folk aren't allowed to gather any more as they're seen as a threat to the ruling class, so massive limitations and charges are levied at the pubs to force them out of business. That means only the big chains end up surviving, which generally all end up being in the same place and are easier to police.

Before I were to go round cuttin peoples bollocks off I might take a look at how we design social housing in the UK, and where the priorities lie in funding the provision of social facilities. Billions are spent rescuing banks but f**k all is made available to an entire generation of kids who are made to feel utterly worthless.

Strange how the 'gangs' of middle class tossers falling out of art galleries from their 'private views', and generally being loud and obnoxious tits don't seem to get harassed by the police. Or searched. Bet they aren't on drugs either...

I haven't got a problem with underage drinking. It's how I started. It's just that it's stigmatised so much in the UK that causes the problems. All over Europe kids start drinking at 5 - I did in France - having a drink with dinner and under supervision. Nothing wrong with that at all, and it teaches people to respect alcohol. It means also that because it isn't a taboo the kids don't go away and get bladdered at the earliest opportunity.

Anyway. Bollocks to it. I'm not arsed. Just gonna move back to Finland when I manage to sell the house. Back to a good social country where people understand the fundamentals of a functioning country...

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:21 pm 
retrobike rider / Gold Trader
retrobike rider / Gold Trader

Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:05 pm
Posts: 9245
Fair points and well made- but...... Yes I hung around in 'gangs' as a youth but in your earlier post you mention gangs and graffitti in the same breath- been there, done it! The coppers and the kids are winding each other up etc... it paints a familiar and sorry picture and my comments where based on this.

We have a gang of comedy chavs in our town, they hang about spitting, shouting at each other with bottles of White Lightening in one hand and a joint in the other, littering and generally being a pain in the arse. The point I was trying to make is that these little shits are the problem. I don't have a problem with youths in gangs- see my comments on the lads up in the woods with the bikes- good guys.

Someone earlier touched on the merits of common sense being applied to the laws. Take the two polar opposites above and tell me which group of kids is causing problems for society? I wasn't for a minute suggesting all groups of kids are trouble causing vermin.

And why does it have to be a class based argument? I'm as working class as anyone you will meet. I'm well aware of the problems of social housing in depressed areas. I grew up in a declining mining village in South Yorkshire during the miners strike. It was a **** shit hole. I had the same start in life as all those other kids I hung around with, low income single parent family, crap school, left with no qualifications and no prospects. I wanted out and have worked my arse off every day since to make sure I stay out. I'm nothing special, so if I can lift myself out of that situation why can't anyone else? I didn't get a hand up, or any of the grants or assistance that is available nowadays. I also know that more money goes into putting roofs over the heads and food on the table of the people who I left behind than has ever been spent on bailing out the banks. There are people in those towns that have no intention of contributing to society in a positive way. Anyway, since when did privilage and class have anything to do with manners and consideration for others?

Over the years I have given many opportunities for lads like me to get a start in life- given them a job, good wages in a relaxed enviroment, tried to make them feel like they have a chance to make something of themselves.... only to have it thrown back in my face. These 'worthless' kids you speak of have every bloody opportunity if they just got off the bloody Playstation and took it.

The government even with all its mistakes and bad judgement cannot be blamed for everything, there has to be give and take.


 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:38 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Exeter
For me this is just another example of a vague law being passed that doesn't even come near to helping the problems that it's meant to solve.

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