Support London's cyclists TfL DIE IN

So, we have a chance here of exercising our support and to make cycling safer for future generations.
Even if you, like me, are unable to attend in a physical form at least by spreading the word digitally I hope that my daughter has a chance of growing up in a world were riding a bicycle is the safest it has ever been in the UK.
https://www.facebook.com/events/5687513 ... pe=regular

I respect their passionate approach and attitude, however the points on their fb page are a little OTT.

- ALL dangerous junctions need to be redesigned to Dutch standards ASAP.
- Ban on any vehicles whose drivers cannot see adjacent road-users
- Make Oxford Street a pedestrian/cyclling only street
- All London streets to be 20mph

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The fact that ideas like these, while worthy, are totally unworkable in the immediate future, may cast the whole movement in a less-than-credible light.

Just my 2p.

If those 1800 who are attending took a million quid each to donate it'd still not meet the DEMANDS they want met NOW.

Unrealistic expectations without a grip on the cost/time it takes to make changes.

Might be a fun jolly gathering though.

Koupe":1m45r75k said:

I respect their passionate approach and attitude, however the points on their fb page are a little OTT.

- ALL dangerous junctions need to be redesigned to Dutch standards ASAP.
- Ban on any vehicles whose drivers cannot see adjacent road-users
- Make Oxford Street a pedestrian/cyclling only street
- All London streets to be 20mph

Click to expand...

The fact that ideas like these, while worthy, are totally unworkable in the immediate future, may cast the whole movement in a less-than-credible light.

Just my 2p.

Click to expand...

The art of lobbying is to ask for a lot more than you actually want and through the negotiation achieve the desired goals whereby all parties feel a worth of involvement and discussion.
Believe me the political power of cyclists is very high on the agenda for the 2015 gen. election, I have the privilege of being fully aware (up to date) with the future direction of the 3 key lobbying groups in regards to cycling in the UK and their intentions.
Actions like this are very useful public displays of dissatisfaction make the political classes uncomfortable and lend weight to positive argument and action within parliamentary spheres, and it was at a similar point that the 'dutch' model was born through public mass actions starting in 1971 and accelerated due to the '73 oil crisis, reminiscent of the fuel poverty crisis that many are experiencing today? Driving a return of the bicycle as transport.

You can redesign junctions untill your blue in the face ans still not achieve what the Dutch have. Its that liability insurance thingy that causes car drivers to be ultra cautious around cyclists in Holland thats the major safety feature. Otherwise Dutch junctions are little better than ours and frankly Amsterdam on a bike in rush hour will give you the fear just from fellow cyclists, pedestrians and trams.
Some vehicles might make seeing other road users difficult but many cyclists can see these vehicles yet place themselves in dangerous positions. Do not undertake a truck that might be turning left at a junction, you do not need to be at the front of the traffic queue.
Ban vehicles other than bikes from Oxford street ??? Within weeks there would be campaigns to ban cyclists aftet a spate of bike pedestrian collisions.
As for 20mph speed limits, when you watch the London Commute you get the impression that already applies.

So what would you propose? I am interested, as I sit as an area cycling advocate within a national cycling charity and am forever hearing criticism from individuals with few solutions/alternatives being put forward? Traffic separation and Training with a nationwide standard form that councils have to adhere to without officers' 'interpretation' is the current want.

Strict Liability as I have heard it called, the system used by Holland and several other European countries whereby a motorist will be found guilty in any bike /motor vehicle accident unless they can categorically prove the cyclist was at fault. personally I am wary of this idea in that many Dutch cyclists seem to adopt a careless to suicidal approach to cycling or even quite frankly take the piss knowing they're highly unlikely to be prosecuted. However it does result in motorist being very careful around cyclists.
Compulsory road traffic cycling lessons and certificate of completion, all vehicle users should be qualified to do it. Voluntary trainning schemes will never work. Fit it in to the school curriculum along with the three R's at Primary school, no kid can avoid it plus a refresher course before they have the right to leave school at 16 before they are no longer under the systems control. Plus no motorist can get a vehicle licence without this profficiency certificate to show they have seen the cyclists side of the coin.
Get a proper safety standards study done on bike helmets. If they are proved a safety boon then make them compulsory like the motorbike world has. Make bright cycling clothing more financially attractive like tax exemption.
Get serious with cyclists who flout the lights rules or ride unsafe bikes.
Make parking in cycle lanes very unattractive by serious fines.
Seperate cars from bikes in that if a bike lane exists then bikes should be in it not cars and thus not in each others space.
There are lots of things and just blaming one group over another will not help. We all use the roads, we are all responsible !

I will be there and on the cm afterwards.
enough is enough

Enough what though?

Cyclists putting themselves in the danger hotspot alongside HGVs and large vehicles? because it seems to me that's where most of the deaths are occurring.

"There's a big gap, I'll pull out left before he even moves off, he can't miss me here, he's seen me, he's seen me, he might not have, no he has, he's seen me. But he might not have, hmm true, tell you what let's not take the chance. It's like all those deaths we hear about and those protest march rides, just this situation, nah, plenty of time I'm not one of those fools, he's seen me I'll be ok....."

Have these protesters sat in a truck at a demo day and seen the drivers view?
There's a lot of visability, still some blind spots true, but it's not bad. The driver will check and check again and move off, but big vehicles move off slowly, how many riders then chance it? The truck may move off slowly but once turning the vehicle length closes that gap very fast.

Driving a two lane roundabout alongside a truck, well I'm in my rights to use the inner lane, and that truck should stay on his side of the road it's the law, but I know it won't so you know what I'll not try to pass a turning truck. The guy driving in front does though, and look the trailer has swiped his car up the roundabout, 1st thoughts - 'kin idiot why pass a truck?

I drive a lot and every day without fail multiple bad drivers will do something that could cause an accident, but I look out for them, I pay attention, they are doing something wrong so I don't put myself in the dangerous situation, I'll not change their habits so I'll not risk myself.

Two vehicles should not be side to side occupying the same lane, especially when turning, simple isn't it?

Cyclists should sit in the queue of traffic, two abreast. So you'll pull off slower than the car behind and piss him off, but at least you're riding by the law. And you know what he'll have to just drive slower, a tractor wouldn't pull of quickly either.

Oh and look having patience and riding this way hasn't put the rider in the door zone/pothole zone/drainage grid zone/road litter zone either.

Commuting by bike may be quicker where there's less traffic or dedicated cycle paths, traffic is traffic and on the roads and cyclists are part of it too. The risky driver, weaving like a knob and speeding to miss the reds will be the cause of many accidents and what will the law say "traffic is bad at this time, you should've left early and allowed more time for your journey, you know how long your commute route takes, you're nicked."

So what do I propose, change the simplest thing, cyclists behaviour and road use. The knock-on effect will win out.

Everyone nowadays expects to be looked after by someone else.

enough of cyclists being seen as second class.
dont agree with your findings there at all, 3 of the 14 deaths were hit from behind with no turning involved, left hooks are common place and there is no way a cyclist can be blamed for being left hooked IF the driver has overtaken and then turned left.
cyclists going up the inside of lorries (or anything) are organ donors (whats left of them) and indeed darwin award winners but to say the fault lies with the education or lack of awareness for cyclists is wrong, there are many factors at play here, road design, driver and cyclist awareness, people not just giving a shit about each other.
punishment passes
left hook
filtering either side without checking
getting 'door'ed'
pinch points
rlj
the list goes on and on.