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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:43 am 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:33 pm
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Location: The Home Of Mountain Biking, And All Great Things.
Poll Tax demos

Greenpeace actions

countless other successful protests/campaigns

Organised opposition to the National Front has been very successful over the years.

Campaigns against intensive farming, etc. are beginning to reap rewards. Notice how many more stores stock a large variety of free range eggs.

The initial free for all with windfarm permissions is beginning to slow down, with notable refusals.

It is not all doom and gloom.

Two way street, you could argue the anti hunting protests over the years have been so successful that, even a huge demo by the yahoos didn't move the government to go against the Zeitgeist


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:31 am 
retrobike rider / Gold Trader
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Not sure on this but as far a green types of energy go.

Solar doesn't work in the UK for obvious reasons and the photoelectic cells are still too inefficient even if we had any sun.
Wind supplies power at the wrong time of day (as the wind tends to blow at night) and until there is a decent method of storage of energy we'd have to buy back nuclear power from overseas at peak times (and rates) and sell the excess wind energy off peak (cheaply).
The turbines also take a large amount of diminishing rare earth metal to manufacture with intensive and eco impacting processing before they can be used. I have read somewhere the noise pollution the turbines make also make people ill too and then there's wildlife too, basically wind on the whole is a white elephant as Denmark has found out.
Wave is something to look at along with tidal barriers but I guess that rare earth metals are also needed too but they must be better than the above for dependency.

Carl.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:44 am 
Old School Hero

Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:27 pm
Posts: 205
well in that case ,we should all give up now and maybe even do all we can to hasten mankind's early demise,phew, glad we've got that sorted.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:28 am 
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highlandsflyer wrote:
Two way street, you could argue the anti hunting protests over the years have been so successful that, even a huge demo by the yahoos didn't move the government to go against the Zeitgeist

You could also argue that moving to legislate on such relatively trivial matters (*awaits backlash*) is often used as a distraction in order to push through more important and potentially more contentious laws.

The tree huggers can have their solar power if I can have a privatised NHS. Deal?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:38 am 
Old School Hero

Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:27 pm
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How do you seee yerself as the opposite of a tree hugger?


tree kicker?


earth beater?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:47 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:08 am
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Location: French Alps/Annecy
drcarlos wrote:
Not sure on this but as far a green types of energy go.

Solar doesn't work in the UK for obvious reasons and the photoelectic cells are still too inefficient even if we had any sun.
Wind supplies power at the wrong time of day (as the wind tends to blow at night) and until there is a decent method of storage of energy we'd have to buy back nuclear power from overseas at peak times (and rates) and sell the excess wind energy off peak (cheaply).
The turbines also take a large amount of diminishing rare earth metal to manufacture with intensive and eco impacting processing before they can be used. I have read somewhere the noise pollution the turbines make also make people ill too and then there's wildlife too, basically wind on the whole is a white elephant as Denmark has found out.
Wave is something to look at along with tidal barriers but I guess that rare earth metals are also needed too but they must be better than the above for dependency.

Carl.


Strangely all the turbine designs ( most of which cause infra-sound problems which causes depression, low milk yield in dairy cattle and other things) have been designed by companies with a vested interest in the energy companies themselves, the designs were put out to tender and surprise surprise the energy company designs won, the designs put through by independent engineering or universities used far less rare earths and had infra sound baffles, and no need for 'hot spinning' i.e. using electricity to keep the turbine turning, these would have been far better in the long run but given the propensity of backhanders and keeping the oil/energy companies happy these designs were not used.



Privatise the NHS ? :lol: The NHS was the pride of the UK until successive tory governments and one labour one put supermarket managers in charge and tried to run it like a business.

Do you actually know what you are on about or do you just read the daily mail ? :wink:
Oh and by the way I was in the poll tax demonstrations as well as many others lived on Twyford Down for 7 months (not thazt it changed anything) and have been detained at her majesty's pleasure for my actions. No not much has changed but if you don't stand for something you'll fall for anything, a bit clichéd but true nonetheless


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:54 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:08 am
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Location: French Alps/Annecy
careful now wrote:
How do you seee yerself as the opposite of a tree hugger?


tree kicker?


earth beater?



:lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:54 am 
MacRetro rider
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Opposite of a tree hugger..................everyone else :roll:


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:17 am 
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Location: wales
As I remember it the roads protests in the 90s were concerned with stopping roads being built rather than securing better drainage.

Yes, in the media the key issue was to prevent certain roads being built due to their negative impact on the natural and historical environment, this is what the media loved.
However prior to this highways regularly bulldozed their way through the landscape, not putting in place any environmental protection nor were req'd to by the government.
A lot of these roads where and do go through agricultural land and road surface run off is a major issue and needs to be managed as it is incredibly polluting to nature and FOOD.
Though not all the roads where stopped it meant that the issues where highlighted and at least the environmental impact has been reduced, is managed and it is a legal requirement to carry out assessments and engineering.
So the road protests worked in their key aim of reduction of environmental impact of road infrastructure.

As for the Criminal and Justice act though a bloody insidieous piece of legislation, it has been challenged successfully and continues to be.

The problem is that far too much information is fed to us via multi-media and this can make informed decisions very difficult, recently ''squatting'' or adverse possession (the legal term) was made a criminal act and was reported as so, which isn't correct. To apply for adverse possession of a residential property or a commercial/industrial property wherein adaptation to allow residential use is a criminal act, applying for adverse possession or 'squatting' any non-residential property/land entirely legal as it is the way large companies get land for nothing and has a parlance to 'aggressive' tax avoidance.

sorry for the long post but i do a lot of work that involves the re-evaluation of resources and infrastructure.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:10 pm 
Retro Guru
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Location: Glasgow
careful now wrote:
How do you seee yerself as the opposite of a tree hugger?

Someone who considers green issues to be way way down the list of priorities, at least compared with the consensus on here. Not surprising given the demographic right enough.

B77 wrote:
Do you actually know what you are on about or do you just read the daily mail ?

I don't read papers other than online, and the Mail site isn't top of my list. Believe it or not I'd say the Guardian probably is, although that's more to amuse myself with the comments below the line. I'm no expert on anything bar my work and my main hobby but I'm degree educated and as well read as most men in the street. I know what I like and what I don't. I favour choice, minimal state interference, low taxes and a bit of personal responsibility. The NHS is the polar opposite to that ideal. As is the welfare system which needs much deeper reform than currently proposed. Put simply I believe I'm a better judge of how to spend my own money than any politican, campaigner, academic or big state socialist.

I'm well used to being in the minority on message boards. For some reason those I frequent don't seem to reflect the population at large. It doesn't bother me in the slightest.


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