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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:26 pm 
North Wales AEC / OWMTBC 2010 Champion
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I'm still using a Belinea 19" CRT monitor for my PC and watch telly on my Panasonic Quintrix 32" TV which costs thousands new and came with built in dolby digital. I have often thought of changing to LCD but I'm always put off when I see the picture quality and the "digital blur".
I just find the picture much sharper and the colours much more defined on my old CRT's. I've heard that the new LED with 2ms refresh and 120hz are much better. Anyone with knowledge and advise? I'll need to change my PC monitor soon.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:34 pm 
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lcd hd using a hdmi cable you don't get any noticeable blur

most people who get blur usually are still on the scart av channel or have non hd lcd


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:42 pm 
North Wales AEC / OWMTBC 2010 Champion
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I see it walking round Comet and in friends/families houses, there are a few different types of blur. The motion blur on fast moving pictures and then the hew blur around objects. Colours aren't as deep and the contrast not as sharp. What turns me off the most is the motion blur, will I get that on my PC?


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 9:45 pm 
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I used a CRT for quite a longe time, but when they changed to TFT's at work it was like night and day
At home a difference from my TFT to my girlfriends LED is huge and regular TV's to our LED Full HD too... cant get too technical (no knowledge), but it has a remarkable definition..


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:03 pm 
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Easy_Rider wrote:
I see it walking round Comet and in friends/families houses, there are a few different types of blur. The motion blur on fast moving pictures and then the hew blur around objects. Colours aren't as deep and the contrast not as sharp. What turns me off the most is the motion blur, will I get that on my PC?
have you tried an optician lol

when do you see the blur, is the tv hd? is the sky box hd? are they on the right av channel


are you just so tight to buy a new tv that you are seeing things?


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:05 pm 
North Wales AEC / OWMTBC 2010 Champion
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Ok so the latest LCDs are comparable now.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:10 pm 
North Wales AEC / OWMTBC 2010 Champion
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bigmick wrote:
Easy_Rider wrote:
I see it walking round Comet and in friends/families houses, there are a few different types of blur. The motion blur on fast moving pictures and then the hew blur around objects. Colours aren't as deep and the contrast not as sharp. What turns me off the most is the motion blur, will I get that on my PC?
have you tried an optician lol

when do you see the blur, is the tv hd? is the sky box hd? are they on the right av channel


are you just so tight to buy a new tv that you are seeing things?


They do blur, just google it.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Display_lag#section_2
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDTV_blur
It's quite obvious once you notice it. I've been looking at plasma/LCD for years but I just walk out again when I see the quality.
I know a couple of years ago LCD tvs did not meet to full colour standards for film and tv, not sure about now.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:33 pm 
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I have only recently begun using flat panels for color critical work.

Also, high end CRTs may have a smaller dot pitch than the LCDs you are looking at.

Take a gander at a high end LCD and they are fantastic, but not cheap.

You can pick up a seriously high end CRT for peanuts second hand.

:)


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 10:57 pm 
North Wales AEC / OWMTBC 2010 Champion
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Ok so I need to look at OLEDs? What's this strobing effect?


Quote:
Comparison of CRT, LCD, Plasma, and OLED

Further information: Comparison of display technology
This is a page that lists advantages and disadvantages with CRT, LCD, Plasma and OLED.

HideComparison

CRT

Further information: Cathode ray tube
Pros
High contrast ratio (over 15,000:1), excellent color and wide gamut, excellent black level
No native resolution; the only current display technology capable of true multisyncing (displaying many different resolutions and refresh rates without the need for scaling).
No input lag
No ghosting and smearing artifacts during fast motion due to sub-millisecond response time, and impulse-based operation.
Near zero color, saturation, contrast or brightness distortion
Allows the use of light guns/pens
Excellent viewing angle
 

Cons
Large size and weight, especially for bigger screens (a 20-inch (51 cm) unit weighs about 50 lb (23 kg))
Relatively high power consumption at high brightness and contrast levels and fast scan rates
Generates a considerable amount of heat when running
Geometric distortion caused by variable beam travel distances but almost no distortion in most high-end displays.
Can suffer screen burn-in
Produces noticeable flicker at low refresh rates although all recent CRT monitors have sufficiently fast refresh rates
Apart from televisions, CRT displays are normally only produced in 4:3 aspect ratio (though some widescreen CRT monitors, notably Sony's GDM-FW900, do exist)
Hazardous to repair/service
Color displays cannot be made in sizes smaller than 7 inches. Maximum size for direct-view displays is limited to about 40 inches due to practical and manufacturing restrictions (a CRT display of this size can weigh about 300 pounds).
The glass envelopes contains toxic lead and barium as X-ray radiation shielding. The phosphors can also contain toxic elements such as cadmium. Many countries treat CRTs as toxic waste and prohibit their disposal in landfills or by incineration
Purity and convergence, affected by the Earth's magnetic field, must be factory preset for operation in either the northern hemisphere, the southern hemisphere, or the equatorial area. Adjustment for use outside a preset region requires high technical skill, as well as safety precautions[1]
 

LCD

Further information: LCD and LCD TV
Pros
Very compact and light
Low power consumption. On average, 50-70% less energy is consumed than CRT monitors.[2]
No geometric distortion.
The possible ability to have little or no flicker depending on backlight technology.
Usually no refresh-rate flicker, as the LCD panel itself is usually refreshed at 200 Hz or more, regardless of the source refresh rate.
Is very thin compared to a CRT monitor, which allows the monitor to be placed farther back from the user, reducing close-focusing related eye-strain.
Razor sharp image with no bleeding/smearing when used at native resolution.
Emits less electromagnetic radiation than a CRT monitor.
Not affected by screen burn-in, though an identical but less severe phenomenon known as image persistence is possible.
Can be made in almost any size or shape.
No theoretical resolution limit.
Can be made to large sizes (more than 24 inches) lightly and relatively inexpensively.
Unconstrained by geographical (hemispheric) location of device with respect to Earth's magnetic field.
As an inherently digital device, the LCD can natively display digital data from a DVI or HDMI connection without requiring conversion to analog, like a CRT would need.
Many LCD monitors run on an external 12v power supply, which means that (with a proper cable) they can also be run directly on one of the computer's 12v power supply outputs, removing the overhead and quiescent power consumption of the monitor's own power supply. If the computer has a PFC power supply, this will increase the power efficiency as well, as the cheap switching power supplies included with LCD monitors rarely implement PFC. This is also convenient because the monitor will power on when you turn on the computer, and will power off when the computer sleeps or is shutdown.
 

Cons
Limited viewing angle, causing color, saturation, contrast and brightness to vary, even within the intended viewing angle, by variations in posture.
Uneven backlighting in some (mostly older) monitors, causing brightness distortion, especially toward the edges.
Black levels may appear unacceptably bright due to the fact that individual liquid crystals cannot completely block all light from passing through.
Smearing and ghosting artifacts on moving objects caused by slow response times (>8 ms).
As of 2012, most implementations of LCD backlighting use PWM to dim the display,[3] which makes the screen flicker more acutely (this does not mean visibly) than a CRT monitor at 85 Hz refresh rate would (this is because the entire screen is strobing on and off rather than a CRT's phosphor sustained dot which continually scans across the display, leaving some part of the display always lit), causing severe eye-strain for some people.[4][5] Unfortunately, many of these people don't know that their eye-strain is being caused by the invisible strobe effect of PWM.[6] This problem is worse on many of the new LED backlit monitors, because the LEDs have a faster turn-on/turn-off time than a CCFL bulb.
Only one native resolution. Displaying any other resolution either requires a video scaler, causing blurriness and jagged edges; or running the display at native resolution using 1:1 pixel mapping, causing the image either not to fill the screen (letterboxed display), or to run off the lower right edge of the screen.
Fixed bit depth, many cheaper LCDs are only able to display 262,000 colors. 8-bit S-IPS panels can display 16 million colors and have significantly better black level, but are expensive and have slower response time.
Input lag, because the LCD's A/D converter waits for each frame to be completely outputted before drawing it to the LCD panel.
Dead or stuck pixels may occur during manufacturing or through use.
In a constant-on situation, thermalization may occur, in which part of the screen has overheated and looks discolored compared to the rest of the screen.
Unacceptably slow response times in low temperature environments.
Loss of contrast in high temperature environments.
Not usually designed to allow easy replacement of the backlight.
Poor display in direct sunlight. Transflective LCDs provide a large improvement by reflecting natural light, but have not yet been widely adopted.
Cannot be used with light guns/pens.
 

Plasma

Further information: Plasma display
Pros
High contrast ratios (1,000,000:1 static or greater,) excellent color, and low black level.
Sub-millisecond response time
Near zero color, saturation, contrast or brightness distortion. Excellent viewing angle.
No geometric distortion
Highly scalable, with less weight gain per increase in size (from less than 30 in (76 cm) wide to the world's largest at 150 in (3.8 m)).[7]
Unconstrained by geography with respect to Earth's magnetic field
 

Cons
Large pixel pitch, meaning either low resolution or a large screen. As such, color plasma displays are only produced in sizes over 32 inches (81 cm).
Image flicker due to being phosphor-based.
Glass screen can induce glare and reflections.
High operating temperature and power consumption. LCDs consume less power.[8]
Input lag
Relatively heavy weight
Only has one native resolution. Displaying other resolutions requires a video scaler, which degrades image quality at lower resolutions.
Can suffer image burn-in. This was a severe problem on early plasma displays, but newer models have incorporated methods to reduce the chance of accidental burn-in.
Screen-door effects are noticeable on screen sizes smaller than 127 cm (50 in); the effect is more visible at shorter viewing distances.[9]
Do not work as well at high altitudes due to pressure differential between the gases inside the screen and the air pressure at altitude. It may cause a buzzing noise. Manufacturers rate their screens to indicate the altitude parameters.[10]
For those who wish to listen to AM radio, or are amateur radio operators (hams) or shortwave listeners (SWL), the radio frequency interference (RFI) from these devices can be irritating or disabling.[11]
Relatively fragile; should only be transported, stored, and operated upright, as the glass screen can shatter under the display's own weight if not supported properly.
Cannot be used with light guns/pens.
Defective pixels such as dead pixels and stuck pixels may occur either during manufacturing (except stuck pixels) or through use.
 

OLED

Further information: Organic light-emitting diode
Pros
Excellent viewing angle
Very light weight
Excellent black level
No ghosting and smearing artifacts during fast motion due to sub-millisecond response time.
Wide gamut and vivid colors because no backlight is used.
Can be fabricated on flexible plastic substrates leading to the possibility being fabricated and of creating flexible video displays.
No geographical constraints
 

Cons
Can suffer screen burn-in.
Increased power consumption when displaying white color.
Blue OLEDs degrades more rapidly than the materials that produce other colors.
Poor readability in bright ambient light such as outdoors.
Water can damage the organic materials of the display.
Can be damaged by prolonged exposure to UV light.
Difficult and expensive to manufacture at the present time.
Organic materials used (as of 2011) are susceptible to decay over time, rendering the display unusable after some time.
Defective pixels such as dead pixels and stuck pixels may occur either during manufacturing (except stuck pixels) or through use.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:05 pm 
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I used to have 3x Lacie Electron Blue 22 on the PC and a Thomson 32" CRT 100hz TV.

I now have 2x Dell 21" TFTs and a Panasonic 42" Plasma. Fed digitally, HDMI and DVI the picture is better in every way. I'd never go back to CRT.

Motion blur, there's motion blur in the filmed frame anyway you soon get used to it. It's not as smooth as CRT true, but the resolution definition makes up for it. You can have high frame rates from digital animation, games etc. and the CRTs higher refresh rate allowed closer matching of the frames for a smooth animation.

In real life, HD TFT flat panels are just way better.

Whatever you buy it'll be out of date in 5 years, or 1/5 the price anyway.
Super HD will not doubt raise it's head, hell when retina display reaches 42" + we'll all want to upgrade.


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