Patriotism

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Harryburgundy

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What does it mean to you - if anything?

Whilst this nation has many things to be proud of, the more I read of our imperialistic past and of our war crimes, the more shameful I am of our nation.

I ask as, according to Andrea Leadsom, our broadcasters should be more patriotic, which struck me as erring towards fascism - but it did ask the question.

Patriotic of what?

No bun fights or ad hominem responses please
 
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Just because a nation has misbehaved in its past, doesn't mean that the idea of a nation is bad in and of itself. Its humankind's mindset (consciousness) that keeps on messing things up (greed/lust/fear/ego/identification etc) ... change that, and all the world can thrive no matter how its divided up politically!
 
nothing to me. I am my own person. I think my own thoughts. Lucky i wasn't born during WW1 as i wouldn't have gone to war. The second was different. I wouldn't have gone to the Spanish civil war. The left lost that war thanks to Stalin.
But Governments love Patriotism and nationalism. Are they different? It looks to me the world loves war and these two always seem to go that way?
 
Ask a Scottish nationalist. You won't get a coherent answer but it's always amusing to hear them try to deny Scotland's part in Britain's past.

One thing's for sure, I'll never be ashamed of something my forebears may or may not have done, or decisions taken in times we will never fully understand. Look forward, not back.
 
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Actually I think patriotism and nationalism are probably very different.
Let's take a crude example. Winston Churchill. To admire him unashamedly would I think be nationalistic. To admire the good he did but to also recognise the very many truly horrific things he is responsible for would be patriotic?

Does that make sense?

I'm with you TT, I feel no sense of either patriotism or nationalism.
 
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Harryburgundy":3veoaxij said:
I'm with you TT, I feel no sense of either patriotism or nationalism.

None at all really :?: Not even when Wales showed England how to get out of the group stages at the world cup :?: Not when Wales beat others at rugby :?:

I know I felt some nationalist pride when the England under 20's won the world cup recently, wish I could feel that more about the full national team :oops:

Yes as a nation we have made some really major mistakes in the past, but in the context of the times they were in, others were making the same mistakes..... I really want to feel that we have learned from these mistakes quicker than some other nations..... Is this patriotism :?:
 
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kermitgreenkona88":3qjo2ulr said:
None at all really :?: Not even when Wales showed England how to get out of the group stages at the world cup :?: Not when Wales beat others at rugby :?:

I know I felt some nationalist pride when the England under 20's won the world cup recently, wish I could feel that more about the full national team :oops:

Yes as a nation we have made some really major mistakes in the past, but in the context of the times they were in, others were making the same mistakes..... I really want to feel that we have learned from these mistakes quicker than some other nations..... Is this patriotism :?:

Concerning sport im neutral. I just want to watch a good entertaining event. I wish they wouldn't cheat and take drugs to win.
 
Patriotism is for scoundrels most of the time. "don't criticise your betters, do what they say for the sake of the country". Not a fan.

tintin40":1i4916wf said:
I wouldn't have gone to the Spanish civil war. The left lost that war thanks to Stalin.

The Comintern were the ones who got the whole international brigade thing going, and the USSR of course was the Spanish Republic's main supplier of everything they needed for war.

If you must find a Stalin related reason the Republic fell, it was the republicans' daft idea that sending the International brigades home and reducing Soviet involvement would likewise make the Nazis' reduce their own involvement. The only way you could blame Stalin for the loss would be if you wanted him to ignore the Republic's request for the Soviets to leave.
 
What does your answer have to do with the topic in discussion rather than start another different argument.
 
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