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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 6:10 pm 
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futuristicoldman wrote:
Diamond back did something in the early nineties with a steel frame, xt and 700c panaracer smoke lites. It wasn't called a 29er back then and i'm not sure anybody bought them over here, they seem to have slipped out of cyclists collective memory.


There were a few different Hybrids back then (check out Halaburts Scorcher here on RBUK for someting real cool).

Also, Wes was doing 28ers before 98/9 while he lobbied for "The Tire" to be made.

Bruce Gordon had some influence.

No doubt there were some big Nokians sent over from Finland via the UK in the early 80's also.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 8:08 pm 
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Marin and Alpinestars did 700c bikes that looked like their MTB's in the early 90's if that counts?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:40 pm 
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It flopped so was only made that year iirc.

futuristicoldman wrote:
Diamond back did something in the early nineties with a steel frame, xt and 700c panaracer smoke lites. It wasn't called a 29er back then and i'm not sure anybody bought them over here, they seem to have slipped out of cyclists collective memory.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:00 pm 
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Thanks for the posts, everyone. I know this has been discussed on the internet, and search engines can produces pieces of the story. I didn't mean that there was a pacific nw movement of some sort, but rather , there were a couple companies from that area that had produced a couple early 29'er bikes. Surly is from Minnesota, but their claim to fame is the push of singlespeed specific MTB's, and being at the forefront of more mainstream exceptance of that.

The diamond back is cool, but those tires are more like monster cross tires, than legit mtb tires. As for the scorcher, never thought of that as a 29'er. Just a cool oddity, that could be used off road, much like a cross bike can be used off road, except as a fixie :shock:

The Finland Nokians stuff is from way back, and while relevant to the modern 29er, not the start of what is now called the 29er, at least from what I understand.

patineto wrote:
jonnyboy666 wrote:
yeah, gary fisher was definitely the first manufacturer to go with it, and quite big at the time aswel, there were alot of "these will never sell" type remarks, now look at it, they're everywhere, and so is 650b . . . sigh . . . :lol:


Gary Fisher got his first 29er build my Steve Potts, because Trek refuse to make one for him..


Ha, that's cool. Seems WTB was always the vanguard. I was definitely looking for comments from people who were in the thick of things, at that time, or at least within six degrees of separation. Sure beats wikipedia.

So, would it be safe to say that 1998 is the watershed year for 29'er MTB Bikes, when things took off, slowly; only gaining momentum in and around 2002/2004 (the years Niner, Surly, Spot Brand, Trek Rig started selling)? There's a Single speed connection there, as well.

Who was the relatively big seller of 29er bikes in 1998-2000 (main buyer of the WTB tire)? What will be the first vintage 29er MTB, in 2018?

Again, thanks, for the contributions.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:01 pm 
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The mentioning of Surly got me looking, and I found this cool interview, regarding the origins of Surly:
http://www.phoresia.org/?p=401


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 3:32 pm 
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The Motivator was offered as early as 2000 it seems.

http://www.dirtragmag.com/reviews/vicio ... -motivator


found this whilst looking too

http://www.dirtragmag.com/printrag/29-i ... ch-feature


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 4:02 pm 
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GoldenEraMTB wrote:
Thanks for the posts, everyone. I know this has been discussed on the internet, and search engines can produces pieces of the story. I didn't mean that there was a pacific nw movement of some sort, but rather , there were a couple companies from that area that had produced a couple early 29'er bikes. Surly is from Minnesota, but their claim to fame is the push of singlespeed specific MTB's, and being at the forefront of more mainstream exceptance of that.

The diamond back is cool, but those tires are more like monster cross tires, than legit mtb tires. As for the scorcher, never thought of that as a 29'er. Just a cool oddity, that could be used off road, much like a cross bike can be used off road, except as a fixie :shock:

The Finland Nokians stuff is from way back, and while relevant to the modern 29er, not the start of what is now called the 29er, at least from what I understand.

patineto wrote:
jonnyboy666 wrote:
yeah, gary fisher was definitely the first manufacturer to go with it, and quite big at the time aswel, there were alot of "these will never sell" type remarks, now look at it, they're everywhere, and so is 650b . . . sigh . . . :lol:


Gary Fisher got his first 29er build my Steve Potts, because Trek refuse to make one for him..


Ha, that's cool. Seems WTB was always the vanguard. I was definitely looking for comments from people who were in the thick of things, at that time, or at least within six degrees of separation. Sure beats wikipedia.

So, would it be safe to say that 1998 is the watershed year for 29'er MTB Bikes, when things took off, slowly; only gaining momentum in and around 2002/2004 (the years Niner, Surly, Spot Brand, Trek Rig started selling)? There's a Single speed connection there, as well.

Who was the relatively big seller of 29er bikes in 1998-2000 (main buyer of the WTB tire)? What will be the first vintage 29er MTB, in 2018?

Again, thanks, for the contributions.



It depends what you define as a 29er, the Diamond Back just used larger version of the MTB tyre used then. A 45mm tyre is the same actual width of the smoke lites ~1.75".
Does a 29er have to be using modern tread design, patterns and a tyre width of over 2.2 or something?
It's as bit like saying all the old bikes are Hybrids or 26er Cyclocross bikes if you compare to modern standards.
Maybe you're looking for...
Who coined the 29er term over 29" or 700c?

(I'm have no idea as I have no interest, but it seems like your asking for something you need to be quite specific about. It evolved over time like the other stuff as far as I can see).
In reality it's the marketing machine of fads that needed new products to sell that helped it on it way, which large companies, advertising outlets where involved in that?


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 5:47 pm 
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[quote="GoldenEraMTB

Who was the relatively big seller of 29er bikes in 1998-2000 (main buyer of the WTB tire)? What will be the first vintage 29er MTB, in 2018?

Again, thanks, for the contributions.[/quote]

Not sure about 2018 possibly 2028. As far as collecting goes, I would put my money on an early 29er Willits (actually I did), Collecting a Fisher will hold value like a Ross does now. Certainly early in the game but not a lot of collecting value. A one off Willits will be like an early Ibis is today, a lot fewer made and custom built one at a time making for a more desireable steed.

Of course this is just my opinion. And there are a lot of reasons to collect things besides value.

That said, I used to collect Navajo Rugs. BITD Navajo saddle blankets were cheap and plentiful. When they became collectible, their value shot way up. from an investment viewpoint, one would have been better off buying 100 saddle blankets and reselling them 40 years later than 10 beautifully woven rugs over the same time frame.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 5:54 pm 
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kaiser wrote:
The Motivator was offered as early as 2000 it seems.

http://www.dirtragmag.com/reviews/vicio ... -motivator


found this whilst looking too

http://www.dirtragmag.com/printrag/29-i ... ch-feature



Nice! Thanks for the links :D

Fluffychicken, if you have any interest, I would ask you to read the two articles that were posted above. That's my drift.

It seems that once the first mass produced 29" MTB tire was done by WTB, then there were a bunch of small frame builders making 29" specific frames, with the mass producers coming along shortly thereafter, at the turn of the century.

It seems that would be the consensus, from everything posted here, and what I've been able to find online.

Keep the links and stories coming, if you've got them. I'm very interested 8)
I catch on to things 10 to 15 years after the fact :P


Ductape wrote:
[quote="GoldenEraMTB

Who was the relatively big seller of 29er bikes in 1998-2000 (main buyer of the WTB tire)? What will be the first vintage 29er MTB, in 2018?

Again, thanks, for the contributions.


Not sure about 2018 possibly 2028. As far as collecting goes, I would put my money on an early 29er Willits (actually I did), Collecting a Fisher will hold value like a Ross does now. Certainly early in the game but not a lot of collecting value. A one off Willits will be like an early Ibis is today, a lot fewer made and custom built one at a time making for a more desireable steed.

Of course this is just my opinion. And there are a lot of reasons to collect things besides value.

That said, I used to collect Navajo Rugs. BITD Navajo saddle blankets were cheap and plentiful. When they became collectible, their value shot way up. from an investment viewpoint, one would have been better off buying 100 saddle blankets and reselling them 40 years later than 10 beautifully woven rugs over the same time frame.[/quote]

Well said.

An early 29er Willets is cool now, and should be in another 10 to 15 years, for other reasons; not necessarily speaking of monetary returns, but maybe.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:34 am 
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I used to have a...poster (big add ripped out of velo news in '92) of Dave Wiens racing on an overdrive, same colour makeup as the axis (green splattery) i think.


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