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PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 11:24 am 
retrobike rider / Gold Trader
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Looking forward to the least scientific comparison of bounce/no bounce ever attempted, unless of course you're going to fit both bikes with power meters and agree a level to pedal at. Then we can prove that rigid bike are faster when there's no bumps and vice-versa and everyone can sleep well at night.

Should be fun though - hope somebody's going to be filming it for our enjoyment! :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:17 pm 
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elPedro666 wrote:
Looking forward to the least scientific comparison of bounce/no bounce ever attempted,


Exactly - :D


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 3:39 pm 
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Quote:
1. light FS - carbon goodness with twin lock out


If you're trying to prove a point I suggest you don't use those :)

Anyway, I suspect the fastest bike around jonnyboy's training route is a cyclocross bike.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:08 am 
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MikeD wrote:
Quote:
1. light FS - carbon goodness with twin lock out


If you're trying to prove a point I suggest you don't use those :)

Anyway, I suspect the fastest bike around jonnyboy's training route is a motorbike.


the point I think I am making :? is that even on a flat (i.e not hilly) and rough (i.e. not road tarmac) surface, an FS will be faster, reasoning being that the bumnps are soaked up by the suspension so the rider CoG is not moving as much as it would on rigid so less energy is wasted by the rider.

I accept that on the uphills, due to the much lower speeds involved, the FS is not going to come out on top, in fact I used the lock out on those :)

ain't gonna happen this weekend but let me know timne and place and I cna plan for next w/e or later (except when it is raining :twisted: )

.... I have a HRM so if OP has one too, we could use that as some was as measure of effort; perhaps swapping bike for the same stretch, otherwsie I cannot see how the difference can be quantified.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:34 pm 
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02gf74 wrote:
the point I think I am making :? is that even on a flat (i.e not hilly) and rough (i.e. not road tarmac) surface, an FS will be faster, reasoning being that the bumnps are soaked up by the suspension so the rider CoG is not moving as much as it would on rigid so less energy is wasted by the rider.

I accept that on the uphills, due to the much lower speeds involved, the FS is not going to come out on top, in fact I used the lock out on those :)

ain't gonna happen this weekend but let me know timne and place and I cna plan for next w/e or later (except when it is raining :twisted: )

.... I have a HRM so if OP has one too, we could use that as some was as measure of effort; perhaps swapping bike for the same stretch, otherwsie I cannot see how the difference can be quantified.


There is enough inherent dampening and spring in a decent frame, seat, bars, etc., even on a rigid, to cope with 'rough' surfaces, i.e. gravel/smaller chippings, hardpack clay, dry , mildly corrugated mud/sand/whatever.

Front shocks and a rider light in their saddle takes care of other irritations up to maybe a few inches high, and the occasional drop off, medium hit, etc. Your LEGS and ARMS are much more efficient suspension components than you will find on ANY bicycle.

For flattish non technical circuits you care carrying around extra weight and inefficiency that is not made up for by any esoteric benefit, (remembering your cog is no more maintained when you are planted on a full suss or levitating above a springy steel hardtail on your elastic body parts).

In fact, out of the saddle where necessary you are benefiting from additional factors similar to those or the larger wheeled bicycle.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:28 pm 
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highlandsflyer wrote:
Front shocks and a rider light in their saddle takes care of other irritations up to maybe a few inches high, and the occasional drop off, medium hit, etc. Your LEGS and ARMS are much more efficient suspension components than you will find on ANY bicycle.

For flattish non technical circuits you care carrying around extra weight and inefficiency that is not made up for by any esoteric benefit, (remembering your cog is no more maintained when you are planted on a full suss or levitating above a springy steel hardtail on your elastic body parts).

In fact, out of the saddle where necessary you are benefiting from additional factors similar to those or the larger wheeled bicycle.


... I don't disagree with you and am kinda losing track of what I'm trying to prove hahaha (in fact the last bike I bought was a hard tail after a few FSs).

For maybe 15 years been riding the dirt track to work on a rigid steel frame bike but due to body beginning to wear out, swapped over to aluminium frame with front suspension air forks, The forks are leaking so have done the same journey a couple of times on a much heavier FS yet is feels faster as the bike "floats" over the undulations .... but it may be all in my mind. :?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:59 pm 
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02gf74 wrote:
highlandsflyer wrote:
Front shocks and a rider light in their saddle takes care of other irritations up to maybe a few inches high, and the occasional drop off, medium hit, etc. Your LEGS and ARMS are much more efficient suspension components than you will find on ANY bicycle.

For flattish non technical circuits you care carrying around extra weight and inefficiency that is not made up for by any esoteric benefit, (remembering your cog is no more maintained when you are planted on a full suss or levitating above a springy steel hardtail on your elastic body parts).

In fact, out of the saddle where necessary you are benefiting from additional factors similar to those or the larger wheeled bicycle.


... I don't disagree with you and am kinda losing track of what I'm trying to prove hahaha (in fact the last bike I bought was a hard tail after a few FSs).

For maybe 15 years been riding the dirt track to work on a rigid steel frame bike but due to body beginning to wear out, swapped over to aluminium frame with front suspension air forks, The forks are leaking so have done the same journey a couple of times on a much heavier FS yet is feels faster as the bike "floats" over the undulations .... but it may be all in my mind. :?
its not in yer mind people who say suspension does nothing are kidding themselves

the same folk will swear cantis are just as good as discs


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:18 am 
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bigmick wrote:
its not in yer mind people who say suspension does nothing are kidding themselves

the same folk will swear cantis are just as good as discs


I don't think, on this occasion, we are saying suspension does nothing.

Refer to my frequent posts about cantis if you really must.

;)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:00 am 
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Location: Edinburgh
highlandsflyer wrote:
bigmick wrote:
its not in yer mind people who say suspension does nothing are kidding themselves

the same folk will swear cantis are just as good as discs


I don't think, on this occasion, we are saying suspension does nothing.

Refer to my frequent posts about cantis if you really must.

;)

did you not say we have natural shock absorbers arms and legs

i remember cycling over the many cobbled streets in edinburgh with ridged bike and it wasn't very pleasant

ok i didn't smash into small pieces but ye felt it like an old bone shaker

got 1st front suss early 90s and a suss seatpost about 96ish not had a sore arse in years


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 10:05 am 
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Horses for courses ...

Looking forward to a TDF winner using a FS bike ... :lol:

WD :D


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