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No further weight reduction?
http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=134317

Author:  Splatter Paint [ Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  No further weight reduction?

The plan was to build a fully-useable, winter hack / everyday bike. I've built a Kona Cinder Cone that tips the scales at a fraction over 24lbs. But I want it to be lighter :( However, I think although I could add titanium crank bolts and a few other minor ti bits, the majority of 'excess' weight now lies in the frame. I.e. if I went carbon or titanium I'd lose 1-1.5 lbs. Take a look at the specs below, is there any further weight reductions to be had for a reasonable sum, short of buying a new frame?

SP

Frame: 2005 Kona Cinder Cone – 7005 butted aluminium (19”) (titanium v-brake mounts, bottle cage bolts)
Fork: 2003 Fox Float 100 RLC (titanium v-brake mounts)

Headset: FSA Orbit MX (titanium bolt)
Stem: FSA XC-140 (titanium bolts on order)
Handlebar: Raleigh Titanium
Grips: Ritchey WCS foam

Brakes: Shimano Deore XT M750 (titanium mounting and pinch bolts)
Brake Pads: Shimano Deore XT M750
Brake Cables: Shimano Deore XT
Brake Levers: Shimano Deore XT M739 (titanium bolts)

Shifters: Shimano Deore XT M750 (titanium bolts)
Front Derailleur: Shimano Deore XT M750 (titanium bolts)
Rear Derailleur: Shimano Deore XT M760
Derailleur Cables: Shimano Deore XT
Cassette: Shimano Deore XT M760
Chain: Shimano XTR
Cranks: Shimano Deore XT M752
Crank Bolts: Shimano Deore XT
Chainrings: Shimano Deore XT
Chainring bolts: Aluminium
Bottom Bracket: Shimano ES71
Pedals: - Shimano SPD M540

Hubs: Shimano Deore XT M760
Hub Skewers: Tune
Rims: Mavic XC717 (rim-brake specific, 36 hole)
Nipples: DT
Spokes: DT Swiss Stainless
Tyres: Schwalbe Nobby Nic 2010
Tubes: Kenda Super Light

Saddle: Fi’zi:k (carbon / Kevlar / titanium)
Seatpost: Ritchey Pro Carbon (titanium bolts)
Seatpost Binder: Tune

Weight: 24.1 lbs

Author:  WD Pro [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:37 am ]
Post subject: 

Lots of little ti bolts on Toronto cycles - not going to save you much though :lol:

Out of interest - What are your frame, tyre, tube and pedal weights ?

WD :D

Author:  tintin40 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:39 am ]
Post subject: 

buy a ti BB and ti axels on the spd will get it below 24lb

Author:  cyfa2809 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:50 am ]
Post subject: 

maybe a slightly smaller tyre size?

Author:  jmacbrid [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:06 am ]
Post subject: 

Less spokes could always help...

Author:  Giel [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:00 am ]
Post subject: 

ditch the suspension fork in favour of a rigid Pace or some such thing;)

Author:  FluffyChicken [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:49 am ]
Post subject: 

tintin40 wrote:
buy a ti BB and ti axels on the spd will get it below 24lb


Forget that, just buy some lighter pedals all in
Current ones are about 360g so quite heavy in comparison

Buying a 300g or less pair would drop it below and will drop more for quite a bit less than other methods.

Given you have XT and Ti/Carbon upgrades, pedals are lagging behind a bit ;)

Author:  jamabikes [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:54 am ]
Post subject: 

grip shifts will save a load of weight, 1x9?

Author:  Splatter Paint [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:58 am ]
Post subject: 

Pedals eh? But only a 60g weight reduction? Working on £/g that's a lot of money.

Frame weight is about ~1900g I think. I had an 18" version of the same frame which was ~1800g, so the 19" will be a tad more than that.

Tyres: ~470g (claimed)
Tubes: ~140g (internet)

SP

Author:  Dr S [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:13 am ]
Post subject: 

Have a big poo before riding and don't eat as much?

I have built super light bikes before but they were all hampered by a rider that cannot say no to beer and kebabs.

Food for thought? Or not as the case could be.

Author:  JeRkY [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:21 am ]
Post subject: 

Dr S wrote:
Have a big poo before riding and don't eat as much?

I have built super light bikes before but they were all hampered by a rider that cannot say no to beer and kebabs.

Food for thought? Or not as the case could be.


too true!

On the weight saving front, try going tubeless?

Alternatively buy my KHS team alite frame at a reported 1405g the £/g rate would be fairly advantageous.

Author:  FluffyChicken [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:46 am ]
Post subject: 

Splatter Paint wrote:
Pedals eh? But only a 60g weight reduction? Working on £/g that's a lot of money.

Frame weight is about ~1900g I think. I had an 18" version of the same frame which was ~1800g, so the 19" will be a tad more than that.

Tyres: ~470g (claimed)
Tubes: ~140g (internet)

SP


?? But you're buying Ti bolts :? to loose negligible weight for excessive ££ I assumed it wasn't a problem ;)

60g is 0.13lb takes you below the 24lb mark and 23.x lb sounds so much lighter :lol: plus it's a strong reusable upgrade.
I don't think tubeless will not save you anything, I would say it would be heavier even ghetto style as your inner tubes are quite light but you can get lighter around the 80 to 100g mark. But you could probably get a set of light pedals for the cost of them (second hand) and they would last longer :lol:

You've hit a point
I was assuming you're frame was not going to change as that well changes the bike.

Author:  WD Pro [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:51 am ]
Post subject: 

Splatter Paint wrote:
Pedals eh? But only a 60g weight reduction? Working on £/g that's a lot of money.

Frame weight is about ~1900g I think. I had an 18" version of the same frame which was ~1800g, so the 19" will be a tad more than that.

Tyres: ~470g (claimed)
Tubes: ~140g (internet)

SP


From the weight weenie forum :

WD Pro wrote:
Kenda Klimax Lite 345 (New / 1.95) = 323.7g & 325.4g :D

WD :D


WD Pro wrote:
Maxxis Fly Weight (1.5/1.7 Presta) = 78.5g & 78.6g

Rimstrip supplied with above = 15.3g & 15.2g

WD :D


412g / 0.9 lb 8) That's quite a high weight saving for around £50 :shock: and then you could sell the stuff you remove ;-)

The pedals I mentioned have already been discussed now :D

WD :D

Author:  FluffyChicken [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:58 am ]
Post subject: 

Inner tubes I agree with, but tyres I don't as using a fragile tyre on a Winter bike, hows it in the mud and wet roots compared to a Nobby Nic?

But really you have hit the problem of building with reasonably light well speced parts, you get a reasonably light bike. Anything more is replacement so cost a fair bit.

Author:  cyfa2809 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:04 pm ]
Post subject: 

drill your seatclamp and spacers.

shorten your seatpost as much as you dare
smaller ratio cassette? dura ace?

Author:  tintin40 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:36 pm ]
Post subject: 

save your £££ and just ride and enjoy

Author:  wadsy [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:42 pm ]
Post subject: 

Lighter fork 'springs' to mind, like a SID

Grip-shift like previously mentioned, maybe Avid V's instead of xt? :?

Road mech/cassette can save quite a bit depending on what ratios you want you use ;)

Also if you could get a lighter wheelset than the XT 36H that would be good :) - I'm sure you know that :lol:

I think that that Ritchey 'post is comparatively heavy too, have a look for a USE carbon Alien ;)

Do you have weights for each component then we can compare ;)

Cheers

Author:  cyfa2809 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:55 pm ]
Post subject: 

spinner aeris?

Author:  The Ken [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:57 pm ]
Post subject: 

pedals - a set of light cage pedals can come in at 100g's less than that.

Look at the macretro weenie build competition for inspiration - Kaiser's just built a sub 18lb cannondale SS

Author:  rosstheboss [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:05 pm ]
Post subject: 

As said before 36 spokes is overkill, unless you're hefty, then whats the point of a light bike??? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Lighter wheels/tyres make so much difference, wasn't the old quote 'an ounce off the wheels is worth a pound off the frame' or have I just made that up?

Author:  stevec1975 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:18 pm ]
Post subject: 

You have loads of scope to get this down to sub 20 if you have the wallet and inclination!

Obvious places have already been mentioned, but wheels etc would make the most difference in the actual ride, as well as the 'lift' test.

Rigid would make a massive difference also, obviously.

Pretty much every part on your bike can be tuned/modified/replaced with much lighter bits etc.

For example, my Litespeed frame shown on the link in my sig is approx a pound lighter than yours, but the overall bike is >7 Ibs lighter in total.

Author:  Splatter Paint [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:14 pm ]
Post subject: 

See, this is the trouble with being a weight weenie, I could put rigid carbon forks on it, single speed, one brake and put tyres with naff-all grip and silly wafer-thin inner tubes in, but I won't! I'd buy a titanium unicycle if I was really being obsessive.

Nobby Nics are fragile enough and I've used Maxxis Flyweight tubes before-they're awful. A close-ratio road cassette is a much use as a chocolate fireguard when you've been in the saddle for 4 hours and are confronted with a great big hill. Ditto rigid forks, fine for posting up fancy pics on the forum, hacking down rough trails I'd rather have my 4" travel Fox Forx. Same with single speed, mountain bikes come with lots of gears for a reason! Non-SPD pedals? Yes, perhaps lighter, but I like SPDs....

Fitness-wise, I used to be pretty fit, 3rd at the Brighton Big Dog, 5th 3 years in a row in the Cheddar bike fest team event. I had surgery last year so I'm struggling to get fit again, but it'll come, oh yes.

Addmittedly 36 hole wheels are overkill, but they were £75 the pair so I'm not about to swap them out. The ti bits were all acquired at bargain basement prices, or presents. For Christmas I asked for titanium! :D

I think the bottom line is that the Cider Cone is at the pinnacle of it's development, any further weight reduction will either compromise the usability or cost serious amounts of cash. :roll:

Still, 24.1 lbs isn't bad.... especially considering the whole build cost less than a pair of Fox Float forks retail for new!

SP

Author:  kaiser [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:27 pm ]
Post subject: 

I guess I'd go for frame first( I know you want to keep it but its fairly lardy) Can't find a weight for XT cranks rings and BB but I guess they will be on the utilitarian side. Pedals as mentioned

Author:  tintin40 [ Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:03 pm ]
Post subject: 

Splatter Paint wrote:
S

Still, 24.1 lbs isn't bad.... especially considering the whole build cost less than a pair of Fox Float forks retail for new!

SP


agree. sounds like you have a good rider built. resist the weight weenie be happy with what you have.
believe me. it's no fun being a weight weenie. I've got it under control now.
Also i've learnt never to trust manufactures claimed weights :x

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