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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 9:58 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:04 pm
Posts: 78
Location: Bonn, Germany
@viscount nice one, looks huge tho ;) is that 24" or even bigger.
Point taken about the wheels, guess you are right with 27". Eyelets - I learn something new every day. Being rather new to the UK (Dutch original) I am learning a lot from forums like this about proper English bikes :) Path racing never really made it to Holland, afaik. Same with the clubman scene.

@Richard about a brake, GB Hidumium with early GB lever would be an obvious choice.

Why not go for Airlite LF hubs? To keep it British... There is a very nice set on the bay, steep price tho -
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/27-wheels-BH- ... SwsB9WASlh


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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:30 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
I am going for a preservation on the paint work and toying with the best method. Tanic acid to stabalise the rust (but not to affect paint) and then a preservation wax. Or Tanic acid, a colour sand with 0000 wire wool of 2000 wet and dry to remove loose rust (staying away from decals) and then a clear coat of acrylic.Anyone had any experience of either of these two methods.

I really want to RIDE this bike in all weather (winter) and feel just a preservation wax may not be enough. I cant believe how thin the paint was 70 years ago. I know there was a war on, but really I have seen more on a water colour. I am worried it will rub off if I don't give it some protection. But if this is a 1947 bike (probably the oldest in existance) am I killing kittens by clear coating?


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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:18 pm 
Devout Dirtbag

Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2008 10:15 pm
Posts: 147
Location: Gloucester
My method of treating this type of frame (when you want to preserve the remaining paint) is to remove the rusty areas to stop it spreading. If you don't remove it, it will spread & you lose more paint in time.

I use a Dremel with a small wire brush to get back to bare metal & then use Kurust. This will turn dark blue, so if you have a light original paint colour it might need touching up with a similar colour, but on a dark paint it will always look better than rust! When it's smooth I use Turtle-wax to seal it & it will also shine & protect it. Give the good paint a light rub with T-Cut, avoiding delicate decals, and Turtle-wax will be better than an over-spray of acrylic or any other lacquer IMO. Works for me anyway: ) I would not over-spray good paint with anything! Just polish it: ) Turtle-wax worked for me on classic cars & bicycles.

Just today I got a 1955 Humber Clipper which is 95% original paint with excellent decals. It'll get this treatment. The general principle is to remove the rust to prevent further deterioration. How you seal it is always secondary to that.

@creindesign My SM is 25" & just a little too big for me unfortunately! I agree with you about the GB brakes period-wise, but they are not the best brakes in use. Especially on steel rims. Depends what your priorities are. Period correctness yes! Effectiveness in use, there are better alternatives. (Period Universals for example.) Many people with bikes from this era 'improved'/'upgraded' as & when they could afford to. Continental components began to be available in the early/mid 50s & many English riders went for them, if they could afford it!


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:09 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
Well I have been working hard. Or should I say having fun. The bike is in its final stage of build. I haven't ridden it yet. Just put the bar tape on. Its once again a rare Sid Mottram ready for the road.
As you know its my first retro build. It is not what I expected. I wanted to do it on the cheap , but so far spend short of £1,000. That includes everything including petrol and parts bought twice, tools, tannic acid and Rustin that i did not use. The technical stuff: The wheel are Airlight, on Fiamme sprint rims, Rally Vittoria tubs. The Chainset is an 80s Stronglight (I know its no period.) The pedals are French. The rear mech in a Campagnolo Gran Sport, and front mech is a Campagnolo Valentino, with Campy twin shifters. A new Brooks Swift saddle and Brooks leather bar tape. The brakes are Mafac Racer circa 1950s. Headset is a Brampton and bottom bracket cups are Bayliss and Wiley. It has alloy flint catchers and a St Christopher for luck.
I treated the rust with CLR bought from Screwfix for £6 and it does not mark the paint (keeping it off the transfers). I clear coated with two pack acrylic paint over the finish and this has protected the very thin paint in a way my original idea of wax oil would not have done. It is now silky smooth. I wanted to keep the old patina, because anyone can repaint a frame. I have several. The aged marks were hard won. I was worried the lacquer would not adhear to the surface, but there are no problems.
I found the bike jumbles at Preston and Manchester the best place for bits. I bought some ebay stuff, but the prices there can go nuts. It is not concours standard. Nor its it strictly period. The more you do, the more you learn.


Last edited by RichardDean on Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 8:58 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
Here are the before pictures


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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 12:09 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:04 pm
Posts: 78
Location: Bonn, Germany
Looking forward to see pictures of the finished bike.
Ta, Rogier


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:56 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
These are the before and after pictures


Attachments:
File comment: The finished bike
ReSid13_edited-1.jpg
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ReSid10.jpg
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File comment: another
ReSid12.jpg
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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:26 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
More pics


Attachments:
IMG_0997.JPG
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ReSid6.jpg
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ReSid7.jpg
ReSid7.jpg [ 60.75 KiB | Viewed 390 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:34 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2015 12:04 pm
Posts: 78
Location: Bonn, Germany
Wow! Impressive work, gotta love those handlebars and cranks - rBotM contender ;)
Really like the finish on the frame too!
Thanks for sharing and enjoy the ride :)

Sorry, but I have to ask: do you still have the old cranks and pedals? Any plans for them? They would really finish of my pre-war pathracer build (based on a sloping top tube New Hudson - see attached pic)


Attachments:
New Hudson driveside build.JPG
New Hudson driveside build.JPG [ 313.57 KiB | Viewed 386 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Sid Mottram rebuild
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 6:28 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:17 pm
Posts: 22
Dear Creign design, thanks for your comments. the handlebars are special, but the crank is ott for rBotm. I chose it because it always wanted one and could not find a cheap double. I put gears on it for the Eroica ride. I will be turning it back to fixed when I have finished that. I some times run out with the Hull Fixi Club. they are mad, but they love bikes. there is no VCC in Hull as far as I am aware. I ride with Hull Thursday.I will put the crank back on it. at the last cycle jumble I went to there was a guy with a box of Williams chain rings and cranks . You would get one for £15£25. You are right it would look good on your new Hudson. I love that bike. I wanted something early like that, but you don't see them. I have a picture on my Facebook site of Hull Thursday Riders in 1904 on similar machines. It's the sloping headset that gets me, and those bars, well brilliant.


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