How French is your Velo?

here another "Tout Francais" - a rosé C.M.P. Dural in Peugeot label from the end of 70s, made by Lyonnais CMP factore
and equipped with French Cultural Spidel group set based on a Simplex SJ 5000 with CLB Brakes

... only the tires from Clements with Italian tricolore, which had been produced in Italy


somebody knows what kind of saddle this is - I don't know, but for me it look so francais

markyp":3ms7b6kr said:

Right.....
Currently bringing a La Perle back to life;
Simplex gears, Durax chainset, Lam brakes, mephisto rims....I reckon it would all be French?
I'll list the rest of the parts when I've scraped all the dirt/dust/cobwebs off!

Click to expand...

That's a very interesting looking machine and worthy of it's own build thread. Are you looking to just press it back into service or do a full resto? Either way good luck with it and keep us posted

gridno27":3rdnkwnb said:

here another "Tout Francais" - a rosé C.M.P. Dural in Peugeot label from the end of 70s, made by Lyonnais CMP factore
and equipped with French Cultural Spidel group set based on a Simplex SJ 5000 with CLB Brakes

... only the tires from Clements with Italian tricolore, which had been produced in Italy

somebody knows what kind of saddle this is - I don't know, but for me it look so francais

Click to expand...

Tout Francais indeed, that's lovely.

I've started a thread of the build......
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=393581

allenh":1uxj77ks said:

markyp":1uxj77ks said:

Right.....
Currently bringing a La Perle back to life;
Simplex gears, Durax chainset, Lam brakes, mephisto rims....I reckon it would all be French?
I'll list the rest of the parts when I've scraped all the dirt/dust/cobwebs off!

Click to expand...

That's a very interesting looking machine and worthy of it's own build thread. Are you looking to just press it back into service or do a full resto? Either way good luck with it and keep us posted

Click to expand...

Re:

Tres Francaise - despite being labelled made in Italy! I think this is probably a Cizeron, or maybe Gitane?

I began a reader's road bikes thread but, after discovering the rims are sprints I ran out of enthusiasm. It's a a pretty undistinguished frame although it bore a dodgy 531 sticker when bought. Seat post is only about 26mm so ruled that out. I suspect it's probably close to "tuyau de gaz"

Currently in bits but I guess I'll get round to a refurb when the weather improves...

Re: Re:

chickendrumsticks":2eox09ei said:

Tres Francaise - despite being labelled made in Italy! I think this is probably a Cizeron, or maybe Gitane?

I began a reader's road bikes thread but, after discovering the rims are sprints I ran out of enthusiasm. It's a a pretty undistinguished frame although it bore a dodgy 531 sticker when bought. Seat post is only about 26mm so ruled that out. I suspect it's probably close to "tuyau de gaz"
Currently in bits but I guess I'll get round to a refurb when the weather improves...

Click to expand...

If it were mine I'd restore it for no other reason than how many do you see? Keep us posted on progress

Thanks - that very true. I think they'rs pretty rare over here at least. Further to a possible frame builder - the only real clue is a frame number stamped on the nearside dropout.

Candidates are certainly Cizeron (they made frames for Geminiani's racing team back in the day) and Gitane, Lejeune and Mercier are all mentioned here and there...

Any info on French makers' numbering? There's precious little out there - at least I can't find anything. Here's info about Cizeron's involvement but I guess it's the production of racing frames rather than ordinary road bikes.

bit of googling suggests Gitane as a maker but in one piece I read it seems Gitane for the earlier ones and somewhere Italian for the later ones.

The parts on it may help as it seems the later ones had more Italian parts than French

Very insightful allenh. I hadn't really considered that the components could give good clues to the bike's origin, so I'll list them below.

There are FEW FRENCH bits in fact:
Maillard s/f hub at rear(with a Spidal skewer) laced to a Mavic Monthlery 36 sprint rim. Another Mavic 36 sprint rim up front but this one has a plain red label - not a Monthlery. And Simplex derallieurs and levers. That's it! I'm guessing the wheels are not original anyway what with mismatched rims and hubs.

Now, as to ITALIAN bits:
A l/f front hub with an Ofmega skewer (although the hub doesn't really look like any other I can see on Velobase, and has a chrome barrel and alloy flanges). A Regina 5 speed block. Ofmega crankset with 52/42 rings. The saddle is a Sella Italia Sprint in a fetching light brown suede. ALE Rapid toe-clips - pretty rusty but I think rescuable(?!). Pedals are a quill style but so corroded as to be unidentfiable. Stem is a 3ttt "Touriste" alng with 3ttt bars - possibly "Grand Prix v2. The seat post is an STM single bolt with a cast neck. Balilla Tipo Corsa c/p brakes with matching levers - the gum hoods had turned to - well, gum...And finally, both the headset and the bottom bracket are Ofmega - double RH thread down below of course.

So not so French now, is it? And maybe the "Made in Italy" wording in the decals is not so far wrong. But as to who the frame was made by is still a mystery. There's a small clue in the fact that Ugo de Rosa was asked, in 1958, by Geminiani to make him a bike for the upcoming Giro. De Rosa was subsequently hired as a mechanic for the Geminiani team. And of course the de Rosa name lives on.

Thus there's a possibility this is a de Rosa frame? I can find no reference to any other Italian maker who was involved with Geminiani at any time.

So, in answer to the question "How French is your velo?" probably not very.
A new thread "How Italian is your bicicletta?" might get a bit crowded!

In the info I looked at I came to the conclusion that yours is an Italian one (the Ofmega chainset is a bit of a common theme) but there is a bit of info out there and I still think its well worth restoring, although if it were mine I'd probably ditch the tubs