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 Post subject: Tubular Tyre Questions!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:17 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Location: Staffordshire
Hi all, I now find myself guardian of an early 80s Gazelle TT bike. It has one 700C and a 650C tubular tyre set up. This is new to me. This is what I know:
Pro's still use these (sponsorships permitting) as they offer lower weight and reduced rolling resistance.

They are glued to the rim either with proper glue in a tin or double sided sticky tape which many consider to be the work of satan.

What I don't know:

What happens if you pucture out on the road? Will a mobile phone be the only practical option?

Once punctured, how are they repaired?

Can a numpty get one on a rim so that it stays there?

How the flinking blip do I pump up the tyre of a carbon disc whell that only has a small cut out of one side of the wheel?!!?

Thanks, as ever, in advance.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:04 pm 
Old School Hero
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Location: Stockholm, SWEDEN
Iwasgoodonce wrote:
What happens if you pucture out on the road? Will a mobile phone be the only practical option?


You carry spares.
The traditional place for the spare tire is under the seat.
Image

The proper glue is not only available in tins, but also in small tubes. Have one of those with you too.
Image

Iwasgoodonce wrote:
Once punctured, how are they repaired?


The tire casing is sewn closed around the tube.
    Pull the tire off the rim. If it is correctly glued to the rim, this is something that will separate men from boys.
    Locate the puncture. The classic "put the tube in water and look for bubbles" test will almost always point out whereabouts the puncture is located.
    Peel off a part of the cotton band that is glued on top of the seam.
    Cut the sewing thread to open up the tire. Just as much as you need to get the damaged part of the tube out of the tire.
    Repair tube as usual.
    Put tube back into tire.
    Sew the tire back around the tube (this is probably the most interesting part, working with a sharp needle in a bicycle tire, all the time trying not to get too close to the tube)
    Glue the cotton band back on top of the seam.
Easy, peasy! :wink:
Ordinary needles and thread won't do, you'll need beefier stuff like for sewing in leather. I'm using needles and thread I got from a sailmaker.

Iwasgoodonce wrote:
Can a numpty get one on a rim so that it stays there?


It's not that difficult, really. They can be a really tight fit, though. Be prepared for the taste of blood in your mouth when trying to wrestle a stubborn tubular onto the rim.

Iwasgoodonce wrote:
How the flinking blip do I pump up the tyre of a carbon disc whell that only has a small cut out of one side of the wheel?!!?


Dunno. Pictures of the wheel/cut out?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:04 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:18 pm
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Location: Staffordshire
Thanks Ragnar, that is a very comprehensive answer. Sewing? I will end up in Hospital with a tyre stiched to my hand!

Does the tape not offer such a good bond as the cement then?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:48 pm 
rider | rBoTM Winner
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Somewhere I have a very old 'Cycling' that has an illustrated page on how to fit tubs. I'll try and find it for scanning and post it.

As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words.

Dunlop used to make a tubular repair outfit that included a thick needle (curved is best), strong thread, thimble (very necessary!) and a 'doofer' that you put inside the tub as you stitch and it holds the tube out of the way so as it doesn't get perforated by the needle.

I used to draw a few lines with a fine pen across the stitching before I cut it (with a scalpel or modelling knife and as little as possible, only enough to just get the tube out) and then tried to get these lines to match up as I stitched so as to try and avoid the tubular twisting etc. Whatever happens, they are never quite the same afterwards and really light ones are the worst.

On a better class of tubular there is often a thin fabric liner inside the carcase that protects a light tube from the stitching. Try and get this back into place.

Whatever happens, it's a pleasant way to pass a rainy evening!

:wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:00 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:09 am
Posts: 466
Location: O-HI-O
the tape works fine..... tubulars suck.


im 130 lbs and flatted a tufo a conti a verdestein you get the idea.... ive flatted more tubies in 3 weeks than every clincher ive ever poped


& valve extenders for the cf wheelset

& if you get a flat you replace the whole tire

and ride slowly until you can get home and glue it....


ive always been stuck with the mobile phone.


Last edited by bwhsh8r on Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:32 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2093
Location: Sheffield, top city
Iwasgoodonce wrote:
Pro's still use these (sponsorships permitting) as they offer lower weight and reduced rolling resistance.


not just that. Until you have ridden tubs, you'll never appreciate how much better they are to ride. They grip better, give such a smooth, yet firm ride and providing you buy something half decent they are less likely to puncture too cos the casing is made better.

But for leisure riding out on the road, miles away from home there's no substitute for the practicality of clinchers. Since you've got a lo-pro I guess you'll use it for racing only, so stick (no pun) with the tubs. Buy decent ones - vittoria CXs used to be well thought of. 23mm for road racers, 20mm for testers


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:48 pm 
rider | rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 1:42 pm
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Location: Wakefield, Yorkshire
This might help in some way -

http://velobase.com/Resource_Tools/Arti ... 930521dd4e

Pro's still tend to use tubs as they don't suddenly deflate with a puncture (MUCH better when you're descending an Alp at 50+ mph!) and you can still ride on them when flat as they're stuck to the rim. A guy rode half a CX at the weekend with a rear flat. Probably didn't feel much different to an inflated one in the conditions.

Very light silk ones also make a fantastic noise on the road when they're pumped up really hard! Especially at 6.00am on a Sunday morning up the A1 :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:50 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:09 am
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Location: O-HI-O
lol @ ned

i beg to differ....

ive had a couple that have let me down easy like you say, but ive burst a few that just dropped all their airpressure in one quick second. (one FSST done, the fsst is about how long it took.)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:55 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:18 pm
Posts: 3798
Location: Staffordshire
Thanks guys. I think the mobile phone will be quickest but thanks for the replies. I'm sure I will have to repair one sooner or later.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:00 pm 
rider | rBoTM Winner
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bwhsh8r wrote:
lol @ ned

i beg to differ....

ive had a couple that have let me down easy like you say, but ive burst a few that just dropped all their airpressure in one quick second. (one FSST done, the fsst is about how long it took.)


I think it's the fact that, WHEN PROPERLY DONE (eg by a TdF mechanic), they stay stuck to the rim and don't flail about loose as a clincher (horrible word!!) would therefore marginally safer. In the main - and there's always exceptions - tubs do deflate SLIGHTLY more gradually but I too have had a few quick deflations. (Talking about tyres that is :wink:)

Just use the correct tyre to suit the conditions - which is where clinchers come into their own as they're easier to change.


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