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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:14 am 
rBoTM Winner
rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2016 11:31 am
Posts: 624
Location: North Kent Coast UK
non-fixie wrote:
I'm mainly interested in pre-gruppo era racing bikes, so not at all, as I generally prefer to use period-correct parts.

For my touring machines I like to play around with whatever might contribute to something I want to ride all day. For this year's vacation trips I just finished a build that features Campagnolo Chorus brifters shifting a Shimano RD, SunTour FD over a 6-speed Maillard freewheel and a Stronglight 106 triple and pulling MAFAC brakes:

I like the mix but how are the shift points working on that? I assume they are 9 or 10 speed brifters working with the 6 speed freewheel?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:46 am 
Old School Hero
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Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 1:51 pm
Posts: 210
Location: Kingston
I think it really depends on what you're doing.

If you're doing a replica of a particular bike then it's important to get the details right. Watching that film about Pantani recently where they'd made a replica of his bike with modern Shimano on it almost gave me a nose bleed.

Apart from that, I'm not really fussed about a matching group, it's a matter of taste, which is a personal thing.

non-fixie - that tourer looks great!


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:02 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:38 pm
Posts: 1992
Location: Lovely Lincolnshire Wolds & W. Sussex on the beach.
Couple of points to add, particularly about touring bicycles - first there aren't enough of them on the forum. I have three at this time: a 1984 Roberts, 1980 Allin and a 1975 Bill Philbrook (notwithstanding my Hobbs, but bicycles in the Golden Age were often all-rounders).

My Philbrook has a mix of componentry, period correct and chosen for the best performance (in 1975) and works very well today.

Chainset - TA (best choice of chainrings - I don't like triples)
Pedals - Ofmega
Transmission (RD/FD/levers) - Suntour Cyclone
Freewheel - Shimano 600/6
Brakeset - Mafac Racer direct mount + Mafac levers
Hubs - Campagnolo Record small flange
Rims/Tyres - Mavic (32/40), Panaracer Pasela
Seatpost - Campag Record two bolt (super reliable)
Saddle - Brookes B17
Stem/'bar - Cinelli 1a and super rare Cinelli Campus 'bar
Tape - Usually a brown leatherlook to match saddle.

Recently back from a short tour of Catalonia with this bicycle and a Roberts.

Jon.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:38 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:31 pm
Posts: 809
Slightly off track, but nowadays the groupset barely exists of course.No hubs or seat posts for a start.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:05 pm 
Old School Hero

Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 10:33 am
Posts: 232
Location: YORK
I had a Bob Jackson which came with pretty much this set & it was very well made & functioned without problems. I know some of it was 'bought in' like the brakes (Modolo) & chainset (Ofmega made?) but it never seemed to attract much of a following. Was it one of the first groupsets? - 'Tout Mavic' seems to be 1979.
I think it's just about impossible to wear out the hubs but they seem to sell for peanuts these days.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:00 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 6:21 pm
Posts: 290
Location: The Netherlands
allenh wrote:
non-fixie wrote:
I'm mainly interested in pre-gruppo era racing bikes, so not at all, as I generally prefer to use period-correct parts.

For my touring machines I like to play around with whatever might contribute to something I want to ride all day. For this year's vacation trips I just finished a build that features Campagnolo Chorus brifters shifting a Shimano RD, SunTour FD over a 6-speed Maillard freewheel and a Stronglight 106 triple and pulling MAFAC brakes:

I like the mix but how are the shift points working on that? I assume they are 9 or 10 speed brifters working with the 6 speed freewheel?


Thank you. I don't really like the not-so-elegant look of most modern components, but I do like the concept of brifters, and the earlier Campagnolo ones are the least ugly. :wink:

So when I found this mix-and-match table, I decided to give it a try. The brifters are Chorus pre-2001 9-speed ("Campag old 9"):

Image

Be aware that classic cogs don't shift nearly as well as those that were made for indexed shifting. I've tried quite a few from my parts bin before settling on this Sachs-Maillard. It has an interesting tooth design. Upshifts are still fairly slow, but downshifts (where it matters) are immediate. Shimano HG will probably work even better.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:01 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 6:21 pm
Posts: 290
Location: The Netherlands
cromoman wrote:
(...)

non-fixie - that tourer looks great!


Thank you!


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:26 pm 
Old School Hero

Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 2:19 am
Posts: 168
Location: North-East
I have one bike with a matching group, the others are mix and match but all look and work good together, and i’ve Recently realised I have a full Shimano 105 group spread over 3 bikes, which was all acquired gradually!

With so many cheap but half-decent ‘copy’ bike parts from China and Taiwan, I reckon most bikes in the future will end up mix n match lol!


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:52 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2466
Location: Sheffield, top city
Percybigun wrote:
With so many cheap but half-decent ‘copy’ bike parts from China and Taiwan, I reckon most bikes in the future will end up mix n match lol!
I disagree. Most bikes are owned by joe Public, who takes his bike to a shop to be mended. The bike industry will continue to push sales of groupsets as much as possible. If anything, it will go even further - you won't be able to buy groupsets, you'll replace a bike because the gears are cooked. The bigger the "Quantity of Sale", the bigger the profit.

As an example, Ribble cycles used to be my go-to online bike shop. These days there is very limited choice of individual components and last time I looked, a very limited supply of groupsets. The emphasis is on their "bike builder", ie replace the whole bike

The motor industry is doing similar. Engines are now sealed, so no-one can make repairs and the average motorist wont fork out £5k for an engine, so they'll replace the car prematurely.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:22 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 7:51 am
Posts: 1350
Location: England
For me, when they started making groupsets in different finishes (i.e black or matte grey vs. high polished) it often didn't look 'right' when you intermixed parts. This was more of a theme of MTB groupsets. But I understand those not interested in aesthetics and just want performance.

My fixie hack Aelle framed bike is often locked up in public places, so I don't care if its a mish-mash of Suntour crank, campy brakes, Shimano STX headset, different rims F&R and tatty saddle. In fact, I don't want such a bike to stand out attracting the eyes of a thieving tracksuit-clad monkey.


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