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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 7:54 am 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:35 am
Posts: 58
Location: New Zealand
Hi,
I just unpacked an old Carlton frame and noted the rear chainstays are different than my 70s Carlton to allow the fitment of cantilever brake bosses and the 80s C. brakes.In effect narrowing the rear fork somewhat. Imagine a loop Carlton Raleigh frame of the 70s with the top of the loop nipped off. The tapered parts of the swage on the chainstays are brazed onto the rear of the seatpost at the top below the pinch bolt.
C.Bosses on the front forks also and no H/L mount brazeon.

It has no frame number on the BBS except an 'X'. There is however a 5-6 digit number on the rear LHS dropout[full of paint].Cannot make it out clearly.
Paint is a crude met blue and appears unoriginal.
One Pump brazeon is seatpost top mounted[mounts perp to ground].These are always bent. Same as my 74.
Most other parts are not original as it has been changed to a form of fixie configuration.
The front DR is Suntour.The rear D is Shimano 600 arabesque.
The frame has no chrome lugs. It ressembles my 74 Carlton frame at the front and the dropouts. Brazeons on top tube are the same.
Chainset is mainly Shimano 600 but a different chainwheel than I have seen before.
Bracket mounted shifters on front tube.
Rear hub is a Mallard and front is from a Shimano hubbed Morrison[nz assembled]. They all have those Norman /Suzie copy large spools with elongated holes in them.Rims are mismatched with alloy and chrome steel.I will mate up something with the Mallard perhaps?
I have a few MTBs with these C.brakes like wings such as an all chrome Mongoose ATB and it is about 1983 -85 .Worldrider 'Mountainbike' and Scwhinn Mesa Runner.
That is about the only date reference I have but Sheldon Brown's site indicates the numbering repeated so there may be a year numeric on the rear dropout such as 1 - 3 or similar.
I thought I could find many pictures of this frame on flickr etc, but nothing.
Does anyone know what it is?
Pictures added as much as I can today.Comparo to Raleigh Royale frame chainstays [red[]and that iof a C. Corsa[green].


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Last edited by derailled on Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 9:38 am 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:41 pm
Posts: 8226
Location: Cumbria
Can't think of any Carlton that left the factory with cantilever brake bosses....... memory is faded here but don't even recall any of the Carlton Team bikes used for cyclo cross having canti-bosses (center pulls only). Pump pegs would only dig in your shoulder when carrying the thing so possibly a touring frame but these had headlamp bosses most of the time. I think pics are going to be the winner here......

Shaun


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 10:43 am 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
Here's a pic (top one) of John Atkins riding for the Marsh & Baxter* team in the early 70s. Whilst not in Carlton colours the head badge suggests his bike is a Worksop product....and it does have canti brakes.

http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk/racers/jatkins.html

David

*A now-defunct sausage factory in Brierley Hill. Midlanders of a certain age might recall the name.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:00 am 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:41 pm
Posts: 8226
Location: Cumbria
Never saw that bike in a factory brochure though :).

Shaun


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 1:22 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
Midlife wrote:
Never saw that bike in a factory brochure though :).

Shaun


True. Bikes for Joe Public are one thing, ones for top-level riders a rather different one*!

David

*Although Trek always trumpeted the fact that their OCLV machines supplied to US Postal were off-the-peg. Not that they have owt to trumpet about any more....


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:47 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:35 am
Posts: 58
Location: New Zealand
Hi David,

Many thanks for those faulous pictures however I think these are the earlier Weimann centre pull cantilever?
The brakes I am talking about are usually found on MTBs or ATBs as they were called.
I am wondering if someone has actually modifed the old frame to get newer brakes?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Here is the frame number location in the pictures
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

David B wrote:
Here's a pic (top one) of John Atkins riding for the Marsh & Baxter* team in the early 70s. Whilst not in Carlton colours the head badge suggests his bike is a Worksop product....and it does have canti brakes.

http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk/racers/jatkins.html

David

*A now-defunct sausage factory in Brierley Hill. Midlanders of a certain age might recall the name.


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File comment: BBS X
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Last edited by derailled on Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:49 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:35 am
Posts: 58
Location: New Zealand
Hi Shaun,

Yes many bikes slipped through wothout being in a brochure( :
I must get these pictures done.


Midlife wrote:
Never saw that bike in a factory brochure though :).

Shaun


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:41 am 
r.B.o.T.M. & P.o.T.M. Winner
r.B.o.T.M. & P.o.T.M. Winner
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Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 1:41 pm
Posts: 2449
Location: Plymouth, UK
No point speculating with images...


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:09 am 
rider | rBoTM Winner
rider | rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 1:42 pm
Posts: 5131
Location: Wakefield, Yorkshire
derailled wrote:
Hi David,

Many thanks for those faulous pictures however I think these are the earlier Weimann centre pull cantilever?
The brakes I am talking about are usually found on MTBs or ATBs as they were called.
I am wondering if someone has actually modifed the old frame to get newer brakes?

*A now-defunct sausage factory in Brierley Hill. Midlanders of a certain age might recall the name.
[/quote]


You're not talking about 'U Brakes' are you? I think the bosses for these are spaced differently to cantis.


*I certainly do - and wasn't really aware that they had gone.

I do like a nice sausage.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:24 am 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:55 pm
Posts: 8202
Location: New Forest, UK
Are you sure they aren't bosses for the old Mafac brakes that used two bosses?


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