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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:37 pm 
Newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 2:55 pm
Posts: 5
Me and my 16 year old son were new to road cycling last year and a work colleague, noting that the bug had bit, kindly donated us two TT bikes (hopefully photos attached if uploaded sucessesfully but not very confidant). We are currently doing a bike coarse to help expand our knowlegde and contacts so we can bring these fantastic bikes back to life. The bikes were built in the 80's by JF Wilson of Sheffield, which is now run by Nigel Wilson (Jim Wilson's son). Nigel was made up to see them and happy that we were keen to bring them back to life. He was't able to date them exactly and at a price could bring them upto modern standards. I am keen to know if anyone could date them exactly and recieve advice regards the restoration. We would like to do the restore ourselves and are of a mind to keep them as original as possible. The problem with this is, that they are single chainset (52 teeth) with the 6 speed casettes ratios at 12/17, not ideal for Sheffield's hills and starting quickly at junctions. Can we change these? Where do we get the parts for a sympathetic restore?
The most complete bike is Columbus frame with the word "ACCIAIO SPECIALE" on the badge, Campag headset, chainset, seatpost and hubs, Cinelli bars (says 66-90 Campiona del mondo on them), Cinelli stem, brakes say GC on them, saddle is a turbo, cassette is shamano, rear mech Huret, Mavic open 4 wheels. The other bike is Ishiwata 017 frame, Campag chainset, seat post, hubs, Cinelli bars and stem, brakes say GC on them, saddle is a turbo, headset is a shimano 600, the casette I can't ID and there is no rear mech.
New to forums as well aqnd this is my first post, so fingers crossed.


Attachments:
Wilson bike 017 Ishiwata frame.jpg
Wilson bike 017 Ishiwata frame.jpg [ 53.08 KiB | Viewed 371 times ]
JF Wilson bike 18-10-12.jpg
JF Wilson bike 18-10-12.jpg [ 97.01 KiB | Viewed 371 times ]
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:54 pm 
rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:18 pm
Posts: 2373
Location: California
Judging entirely on the Kit the bikes are from the mid 80s, the white one could be a little newer.

Changing the gearing could be very easy depending on a couple of factors. The easiest solution is getting a wide range freewheel, 13 x 28 teeth or similar, and a new chain. You will quickly find however that the new wider ratio will cause the chain to come off while shifting. So next is to get a front derailleur and a double chainset. It may be that your chainsets are for two rings in which case you simply buy a small ring and hope that the bottom bracket spindle is long enough to accommodate the new set up. You will need a clamp on front mech and a left side friction shifter as well.


Wait did I say this was Easy! (he puts head in hand)

Some of the other folk on here will be able to help with a more technical explanation

Steven


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:31 pm 
Old School Hero
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Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:11 am
Posts: 170
Location: Southend-on-Sea, Essex, Uk
Looks like a Huret Jubilee rear mech on the white bike. Legendary Time Trialling mech and still one of, if not the, lightest rear mechs ever.

Steve.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:35 pm 
Old School Hero
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:17 pm
Posts: 199
Location: Chesterfield
I know you're pain, living in Chesterfield we too have our fair share of hills.....sadly or maybe not they are TT bikes and thus require close ratios for keeping momentum and only one ring etc for lightness.
You need to decide just what you want to do, either TT work or general riding around Sheffield and up into the Peak/ Fox House etc if the latter you WILL need a much wider ratio rear and a double front, so you will need two gear levers, front derailleur double front chainset, new bottom bracket (Shimano sealed units are reliable and cheap) etc...to be honest you can get these things easily and occasionally cheaply on Ebay etc or on car boots...you could try asking around local bike clubs too.
For late 70's early 80's stuff Suntour Vx and superbe pro is very good and fairly cheap, rear 6 speed casettes are easy to get hold of but generally in a 6 speed for a wide ratio you'll have to sacrifice something usually a bottom gear of around 13 teeth possibly 12 at a push, you may get a 13-34 Suntour which is ideal for the Peak etc, I used to run that with a 42/52 front on a Carlton Corsair tourer a few years ago all over Derbyshire with no problems at all and I am no superman cyclist possibly just about up to club level-ish if that....as for brakes Weinmann centre pulls when set up correctly are very good or you could go for early Shimano dual pivots....Get in touch via PM if you need any other advice, I have a Wilson TT bike set up for my turbo trainer and I love it...I live in Chesterfield too so fairly close.

p.s The shop will do a great job but to be honest it's good to learn to do it yourself and far, far cheaper.... Ballantine's Ultimate Bicycle book is a good learning tool as is the Haynes bike book...I often get asked to 'do up' bikes for colleagues at work but when you really start adding up the cost for people they do tend to get put off as parts aren't cheap, by the time you've bought all the bits for an average bike it's gonna run near to £100 easily, much cheaper if you can get new old stock off the bay and if you are prepared to do the work yourself.

Nice bikes and a good friend, please don't repaint them they appear great as they are in their original paint which is part of their racing history.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:24 am 
Devout Dirtbag
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Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:18 am
Posts: 131
Location: Bangor - NI
Just throwing it out there, but the cheapest solution to this problem is to simply change the 52 chainring on each bike to a 42 (for example) and keep everything else as is. That's assuming the chainring is the removable type (with bolts) and you buy a new chainring with a matching Bolt Circle Diameter.

I run a single 42 on my road bike and ride mostly flat roads with a few hills. I was drafting a car the other day with a 42/12 ratio and sitting quite comfortably at 25+mph (didn't miss not having a 52 to change up to). Similarly, 42/25 is more than enough for a climb. (I have a 7 speed cassette).

That would be my suggestion before spending large amounts on derailleurs etc.

N


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 12:38 pm 
Old School Hero
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:17 pm
Posts: 199
Location: Chesterfield
Not a bad idea that! though to be honest in parts of Derbyshire you would possibly struggle with 42/25 especially if you're not a really strong cyclist...it's not called the 'Peak District' for nothing!


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:14 pm 
Devout Dirtbag
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Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:18 am
Posts: 131
Location: Bangor - NI
chambo34 wrote:
Not a bad idea that! though to be honest in parts of Derbyshire you would possibly struggle with 42/25 especially if you're not a really strong cyclist...it's not called the 'Peak District' for nothing!


:lol: Sorry - my geography isn't the best! Sure, 42/25 still requires a good turn of the pedals on the bigger hills. The steepest I have here is 11%. But it's still a manageable ratio and most double chainsets are 52 42 at the front anyway - so unless you ride a triple or a compact, most people will just need to get used to 42/25, or 42/28 etc as their easiest gear.

I didn't notice the info on your rear cassette in the OP. If you have 52/17 as the best option at the minute even 42/17 would still be challenging in hilly areas (though still much better). Maybe the best way to get a good ratio, as chambo34 suggests, would be to change the cassette, but I'd still recommend changing to a 42 single to see how that goes in the interim (rather than the hassle and cost of installing a double chainset, front mech and shifters etc). They would also look more original (IMO) with a single front chainring.

The worst that can happen is that you find you miss a bigger gear on the front, and at that stage you could take the plunge into a double chainset.

N

PS an example of a 42 though not sure if its the right BCD for you:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stronglight-4 ... 20d49bc25c


Last edited by nathanm26 on Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:26 pm 
Old School Hero
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:17 pm
Posts: 199
Location: Chesterfield
Yes if you can find a Suntour 6 speed 'block' in a 13-34 or 14-34 and I am pretty sure they did both then 42/34 WILL get up even the steepest hills certainly around the Peak, best to use a Suntour(or Raleigh branded version) VX long cage rear mech with it, some of them have a split cage which makes replacing a chain whilst out a breeze.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:10 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 2:55 pm
Posts: 5
Thanks to you all for your time and knowledge, especially with my lack of it. Yes the rear mech is a Huret, the less complete bike does not have a rear mech. I have just noticed that the rear mech bracket looks out of square, maybe this is why it is missing.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:28 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2013 2:55 pm
Posts: 5
Changing the front chainring to 42 looks the easiest option as both are bolt on type, but as Chambo says the hills in the Peak District are challaging. I ride into the peaks when I can and the hill at the bottom of my road is 1:6 and I have to negotiate this on my way back from most rides. I manage this on a cyclo x bike with slicks and a bottom ratio of 39/12. The less complete bike of the two has no cable guide on the BB for the front mech and no left hand lug for the gear shifter, so in the interets of leaning the easiest tasks first and getting up and running I am leaning towards changing the front chainset to a 42. I can use it for my run about, any advise on selecting/shortening the chain with a new set up? The other bike, my son has claimed and he would like to use it for all rides so it looks like a new gearset with a front mech. Although it has a front mech cable guide, it is missing a left hand lug for the gear shifter, can a bolt on one be obtained? In fact Chambo I may need to take you up on your offer to pm when I get organised. I checked your blog out, some nice bikes on there. PS I was a pipefitter in a former life too.


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