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 Post subject: Classic frame mutilation
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 2:20 pm 
Dirt Disciple
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Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 7:58 am
Posts: 85
Location: Sydney
Not sure if this trend is active in Europe but here in Australia it is happening more and more,the act of classic frame mutilation,or the making if fix wheel bike and cutting of the deraileur hangers and gear bosses just saw an mid 80s Alan on ebay ruined the guy knew it was a classic but still cut of the hangers, this has to stop. :evil: :? :cry: :cry:


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:35 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
Seconded. At least an intact road frame that has been used for a fixed build can be turned back into a geared machine - my old Orbit America was an ex-singlespeed* frameset that I returned to better things. :)

David

*Not, I am very quick to add, built as such by me!!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:01 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 12:59 pm
Posts: 349
Location: Chez Vegas, Derbyshire
Saw it once or twice when the 'fixie' thing first started*. Cable guides were the other item that got butchered.

*Hate the term myself. Sounds like slang for a drug addiction.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 7:45 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2011 7:55 pm
Posts: 305
Location: Basingstoke
Track bikes, single speeds, and fixies are great examples of pure bikes and look stunning without all the extra jewellery required for gearing. I quite like them but like you guys not at the expense of a once lovely classic.

If they keep going at this rate even an unmolested Pug Premiere or Raleigh Mercury will be worth four figures soon! Keep 'em tidy gents you heard it here first ;)


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:01 pm 
retrobike rider
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Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:08 am
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Location: Nth Somerset, UK
I've seen the same thing in the past in the custom motorcycle world.

Decent frame builders could and would start from scratch, but there were some lock up garage butchers who would cut up classic or rare frames.

I would never remove anything from a rare frame, motorbike or bike. If it were ten a penny, common all garden type, then no problem, but otherwise it is just vandalism.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:07 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:10 pm
Posts: 669
I'm reluctant to contribute an 'us and them' fantasy, but if there were a 'fixie'/'gearie?' divide, 'we' could take a look at our own sin quotient before launching stones....

How about cold-setting a 120mmOLN frame to 130 so you can use a modern hub/drivetrain? That is arguably mutilation more irreversible than cutting off hangers.. although to be fair there must also be frames about that have been 'fixed' by cold-setting inwards, too.. in/out/in/out...you know how that ends..

A comprehensive set of braze-ons is great if you're using them, but PITA if you're not... and there is a sort of unhealthy authoritarian finality about them... someone decided for you that your gear-levers and bottle-cage and cables belong right here... THERE IS NO ALTERNATIVE. Unlike clips, which left room for individual choice in component location, for better or worse.. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but the subtle message of braze-ons could be interpreted as; "you are an idiot, let us decide for you", and a braze-on free bike says; "I don't know..it's up to you".

I personally dislike braze-ons on thin walled tubes, but if they have been put there, then I want evidence that they have been there, and the best way of ensuring that is to leave them there, but these days they could have been removed and replaced more than once.. remove/replace/remove/replace...you know how that ends... I can tolerate them better on stays, forks or lugs, where there is not so much potential for mischief..

If people are mutilating 'keepers' then that is their own business, but I agree that it's galling to find them back on the market afterwards. If there is a sharp distinction that needs to be made, it is not IMO between 'fixie' and derailleur/brake user, but between things to be used, and things to make a profit out of.. That would be welcome in all kinds of areas besides bikes.... housing, banking, transport, agriculture, you name it..... er, how did I get here from a mutilated Alan? :? :?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 12:59 pm
Posts: 349
Location: Chez Vegas, Derbyshire
I agree to an extent with you torqueless. Frame builders have been brazing and removing bottle bolt holes / shifter lugs / mudguard eyes since time in memorium.

Without being sanctimonious what makes my teeth itch is when it's done badly (usually with an angle grinder) and then the owner buggers the job up and puts the frame back on the market an 'unfinished project' that someone would normally covet if it had not been butchered. The worse thing is that the 'fixie' craze pushed the price of steel frames up as every hipster was after an original retrobike to 'convert'.

It's each to their own though. As long as you own the frame you can do what you want - it's your property after all.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:29 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2011 12:59 pm
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Location: Chez Vegas, Derbyshire
Just seem this on t'eBay. Forget the angle grinder this is the way to go: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Restored-fram ... 232898e73e


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:10 pm
Posts: 669
Ah... there's a whole peloton's-worth of saturated colours in that one alone... perhaps a 'groupset' can be assembled? http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=242261


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