Retrobike Forum Index

It is currently Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:27 pm

* Login   * Register * Search  * FAQ



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Raleigh RSP titanium
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 11:35 am 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:25 pm
Posts: 30
I'm trying to find out some more information on the Titanium frames produced by Raleigh in the 90's.
As far as I can tell there were three distinct types:
1) Raleigh Dynatech where titanium tubes where bonded into to lugs and mixed with other frame materials.
2) Welded titanium frames made with Timet branded tubing.
3) Welded titanium frames made with IMI branded tubing.

I have a road frame which falls into this third category and I'd really like to know more about where they were made and what sort of tubing was used.

As far as I can tell the Timet branded tubing was some sort of commercially pure titanium approximately equivalent to US grade 4. The tubing was cheap but is nothing like as strong as the more commonly used 3AL2.5V or 6AL4V alloys used on high spec US built frames. It seems these frames were prone to cracking.

Many people believe the IMI tubing was far superior. As far as I can tell the IMI tubing was manufactured in either Birmingham (or possibly Swansea) and the tube forms were specifically designed for the frames rather than being taken from 'off the peg' tube stock.

I think the main triangles on both the Timet and IMI frames were robot welded with the rear triangle being finished by hand.

Can anyone shed more light on these interesting frames?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Raleigh RSP titanium
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:33 pm 
Old School Grand Master
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
mjp200581 wrote:
I'm trying to find out some more information on the Titanium frames produced by Raleigh in the 90's.
As far as I can tell there were three distinct types:
1) Raleigh Dynatech where titanium tubes where bonded into to lugs and mixed with other frame materials.
2) Welded titanium frames made with Timet branded tubing.
3) Welded titanium frames made with IMI branded tubing.

I have a road frame which falls into this third category and I'd really like to know more about where they were made and what sort of tubing was used.

As far as I can tell the Timet branded tubing was some sort of commercially pure titanium approximately equivalent to US grade 4. The tubing was cheap but is nothing like as strong as the more commonly used 3AL2.5V or 6AL4V alloys used on high spec US built frames. It seems these frames were prone to cracking.

Many people believe the IMI tubing was far superior. As far as I can tell the IMI tubing was manufactured in either Birmingham (or possibly Swansea) and the tube forms were specifically designed for the frames rather than being taken from 'off the peg' tube stock.

I think the main triangles on both the Timet and IMI frames were robot welded with the rear triangle being finished by hand.

Can anyone shed more light on these interesting frames?


The final incarnation (ca.1999) of the RSP titanium series was the R800 which had a red & white paint job; previous welded Ti Raleighs tended to come in "natural" finish. I think the R800 had IMI tubing made in Witton, Birmingham[1], although the issue is clouded somewhat because Timet and IMI's titanium division merged in 1996.
IMI and Timet models used round tube profiles, but there were also welded titanium Raleighs offered in the late 90s/early 2000s from a few retailers (e.g. Sheffield Cycles of Burton, Allens of Wombwell) with good connections to Triumph Road, and these used unbranded material and a seriously oversized teardrop down tube; the "finish" on these bare metal frames was a dull silver/grey.

David

[1] Coincidentally, the same part of Brum where Speedwells were built!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:51 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:25 pm
Posts: 30
Thanks David.

Mine has an IMI sticker and a round downtube. The frame is a matt grey colour with bead blasted finish.

I've seen frames which appear to be very similar or identical to mine but with the large aero shaped downtube which you describe.

The welds are extremely neat and tidy and the frame seems generally well finished.

I bought mine as a complete second hand bike. It had a black painted straight blade steel fork (1" threaded) which is very light. It also had a Royce Ti BB and a few Dura Ace/Record parts so someone had spent some serious money on it back in the day.

Does anyone know specific details of what tubing was used on these later frames?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:01 pm 
Old School Grand Master
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
mjp200581 wrote:
Thanks David.

Mine has an IMI sticker and a round downtube. The frame is a matt grey colour with bead blasted finish.


Time-wise that makes sense; silver/grey frames IMI tubes and pre-merger, painted ones Timet. I did nearly buy an IMI-tubed frame off eBay not so long ago, but I'd only recently acquired the Ribble 653 so yet another change of frame for my road bike seemed a bit greedy!!

David


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:08 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:11 pm
Posts: 1103
Member on here bikemeister2000 was a raliegh employee at the time of these titanium frames, and is a font of knowledge.

Worth a PM.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:19 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:25 pm
Posts: 30
I've just taken a photo of the bike.

Sorry it's not very clean at the moment!

Image

http://s19.postimage.org/voaf4v7oj/Raleigh_Ti.jpg

The frame number is G13153

As you can see the bike is currently built up with modern kit. In this guise the bike weighs about 17lbs.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:59 pm 
retrobike rider
retrobike rider
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:08 am
Posts: 6843
Location: Nth Somerset, UK
I just rushed down and checked my garage, as that photo looks for all the world like it was taken against my garage door :shock:

Imagine my disappointment at not finding a Raleigh titanium road bike in there :cry:

As suggested, drop Bikemeister a PM.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:35 pm 
Old School Grand Master
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:04 pm
Posts: 3364
Location: Completely in the dark, thanks to me good mate Terry....
mjp200581 wrote:
I've just taken a photo of the bike.

Sorry it's not very clean at the moment!

Image

http://s19.postimage.org/voaf4v7oj/Raleigh_Ti.jpg

The frame number is G13153

As you can see the bike is currently built up with modern kit. In this guise the bike weighs about 17lbs.


Campag bits, Alien seatpost, ITM fork, Michelins....top marks on the build there! :)

David


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:14 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:25 pm
Posts: 30
You've got good eyesight there David!

Here is the full spec:
ITM Millenium full carbon fork
Record headset
Deda Newton Bar and stem
USE carbon alien post
San Marco Concor Lite Ti saddle
Chorus carbon ultratorque crankset (compact)
Centaur brakes and ergo levers
Record Ti cassette
Campagnolo Proton wheels with ceramic bearings and DT alloy spoke nipples
Michelin pro race 3 tyres and Conti Supersonic tubes
Record Ti pedals
Hope Ti QR's
Record chain


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:33 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:25 pm
Posts: 30
The oracle (aka bikemeister2000) has spoken:

Hi Mike,

IMI were based in Swansea. We worked together with them to design the tubset for our plasma-arc welding at Raleigh Special Products. Timet and IMI merged so it was the same material.
It is not CP grade, but contains aluminium and vanadium to make it more suitable to the welding process.

Best regards


Well if the titanium used was an alloy containing aluminium and vanadium that makes all the difference and means this frames are much better than some people realise.[/i]


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Apple Tree and 26 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

About Us

Follow Retrobike

Other cool stuff

All content © 2005-2015 Retrobike unless otherwise stated.
Cookies Policy.
bikedeals - the best bike deals in one place
FatCOGS - Fat Chance Owner's Group

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group