Help Needed, What Frame Could This Be?

RooKilo · May 31, 2012

Hi, I've been shown this frame to see if I'd be interested in it.
It is of lugless brazed construction, has fastback 'aero' section seat stays, single lever boss, Shimano dropouts front and rear, internal rear brake cable and the rear brake caliper faces forward. It appears to be possibly made of Reynolds Speedstream, the down and seat tubes are 35mm deep by 20mm wide and the owner says it's definitely 531. The seatpost diameter measures as approx 26.6mm. The serial number on the BB shell would possibly date it to 1983 and there is a matching serial number on the fork column. The clearances are quite tight and the wheebase is only 37 1/4"! There's allegedly the rest of the bike minus wheels in a shed somewhere......
Can anyone offer an opinion as to the frame builders identity?

DSC02304 by Rookilo, on Flickr

DSC02306 by Rookilo, on Flickr

DSC02305 by Rookilo, on Flickr

DSC02307 by Rookilo, on Flickr

002 by Rookilo, on Flickr

Midlife · May 31, 2012

Looks a very well sorted frame and whoever made it knew their job even though it's a few years after I left cycling....I'd like to own it LOL

Stab in the dark but maybe someone at Woodrup was having a play

Shaun

foz · Jun 1, 2012

I can't help with the identity, but it looks quite nice though! possibly a time trial frame, from the short wheelbase, aero features and single gear lever boss? The rear dropouts look to be vertical or at least semi-vertical - if the frame is from 1983 wouldn't it have had horizontal dropouts? maybe they've been changed at some point?

Old Ned · Jun 1, 2012

The rear dropouts are Campag and they go back to the 60's. Verticals would be used on a short wheelbase TT frame to enable the back wheel to go in easier. Interesting to see over bracket cable guide (drilled as well!) on an 80's frame. Not many builders could do a good lugless fillet brazed frame so this might narrow the field down a bit. Typical 'fade' early 80's paintjob too.

All in all looks a nice frame.

RooKilo · Jun 1, 2012

Old Ned":3b31p4je said:
The rear dropouts are Campag and they go back to the 60's. Verticals would be used on a short wheelbase TT frame to enable the back wheel to go in easier. Interesting to see over bracket cable guide (drilled as well!) on an 80's frame. Not many builders could do a good lugless fillet brazed frame so this might narrow the field down a bit. Typical 'fade' early 80's paintjob too.

All in all looks a nice frame.

The front and rear dropouts are stamped Shimano, it's definitely a TT frame - it can only take a single chainring and the clearances are quite tight. I've been told that when purchased from Terry Wright cycles, Stamford in 1986 it had already been re-sprayed to the current colour and missing it's identity - if my friend was told it's identity he's forgotten :roll:

The frame has come with Cinelli 65 bar & 1A stem, Aero Gran Compe brake levers, Tange aero headset, Campagnolo Record cranks and an FAG BB (it'll be fun getting that out!). Hopefully in a box somewhere there's an aero seatpost, AGC calipers and a Mavic rear mech. I've started looking online at other TT bikes and nothing stands out that ties it to one frame builder so far though I'm hoping it's an Aende / Vernon Barker / Shorter etc

I'm aiming to get some better photos posted over the weekend, thanks for everyones input so far!

Old Ned · Jun 1, 2012

RooKilo":34e06neo said:
Old Ned":34e06neo said:

The rear dropouts are Campag and they go back to the 60's. Verticals would be used on a short wheelbase TT frame to enable the back wheel to go in easier. Interesting to see over bracket cable guide (drilled as well!) on an 80's frame. Not many builders could do a good lugless fillet brazed frame so this might narrow the field down a bit. Typical 'fade' early 80's paintjob too.

All in all looks a nice frame.

Click to expand...

The front and rear dropouts are stamped Shimano, it's definitely a TT frame - it can only take a single chainring and the clearances are quite tight. I've been told that when purchased from Terry Wright cycles, Stamford in 1986 it had already been re-sprayed to the current colour and missing it's identity - if my friend was told it's identity he's forgotten :roll:

The frame has come with Cinelli 65 bar & 1A stem, Aero Gran Compe brake levers, Tange aero headset, Campagnolo Record cranks and an FAG BB (it'll be fun getting that out!). Hopefully in a box somewhere there's an aero seatpost, AGC calipers and a Mavic rear mech. I've started looking online at other TT bikes and nothing stands out that ties it to one frame builder so far though I'm hoping it's an Aende / Vernon Barker / Shorter etc

I'm aiming to get some better photos posted over the weekend, thanks for everyones input so far!

Campag, Shimano - what's the difference :twisted:

Is Terry Wright still in business? I suppose there might be an outside chance he could remember where/who he got it from? Not sure if Pongo Braithwaite (Aende) did lugless or M&B (as it would have been then). Shorter's had frames from several builders.

Interesting to see a FAG BB with such a short axle suitable for a single ring. All the ones I had were virtually triple length. Good value for money BITD.

Midlife · Jun 1, 2012

No chainstay bridge either...... They were often missing on curved seat tube frames as they would foul the wheel.

as Old Ned says an 80's looking frame with an above the bottom bracket guide from the 70's

Trying to think who built lugless......... Roberts?

Shaun

otherself · Jun 2, 2012

Looks like a British handmade from a boutique builder, esp. being 531 tubed. Serial looks like a date code only: 1st March, 1983.

Have seen Alec Bird, Bill Philbrook and Shorter TT frames from the early 80's very much like this style, with drilled cable guide on top of the BB shell, fastback stays and fillet brazed.

RooKilo · Jun 8, 2012

I've given it a clean up and put some better pictures on. I'd like to think it was a Phillbrook but having looked at others the dropouts are different. I suppose it could have been made by any half decent frame builder in the 80's

Help Needed, What Frame Could This Be?

RooKilo

Midlife

Retro Wizard

foz

Old Ned

Old School Grand Master

RooKilo

Old Ned

Old School Grand Master

Midlife

Retro Wizard

otherself

RooKilo

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