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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:19 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
Just thought some of you might like to have a look at my latest acquisition, " A Geoffrey Butler fitted with what I believe is a 1958 super rare "lipped" crank set :-)

Its packed with serious Campagnolo goodies and will look immense when I get her up and running again.

Ideas welcome on the brand of brake levers and/or anything else you might notice :-)

I am suspecting late 50's on the F&R hubs too. Rims are definately old school because of the spoke nipple being in contact with the tubs.

Like I said, "ALL thoughts most welcome". yours Laz.


Attachments:
GButler whole.jpg
GButler whole.jpg [ 46.35 KiB | Viewed 863 times ]


Last edited by Lazarus on Sun Jun 12, 2011 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:20 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
Best pic I have of the suspected 1958 Campagnolo cranks


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GButler cranks.jpg
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:21 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
rear wheel & hub


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GButler rear.jpg
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:22 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
front wheel & hub


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GButler front.jpg
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:23 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
unknown ? but beautiful looking brake levers


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GButler brakes.jpg
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:27 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
This beauty makes up for the 1 I missed early in the day (was absolutely gutted) " A 1978 tip top condition Red & White Moser ". Still want the Moser though .... sigh. Laz


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Moser1.jpg
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 Post subject: Geoffrey Butler.
PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 1:03 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:38 pm
Posts: 1470
Location: The Lovely Lincolnshire Wolds and by the sea in Sussex
Hi.
Butler's did not build their own frames, but bought them in from the trade (often Holdsworth) the odd one or two were built by well-known Croydon framebuilders - I have a Cliff Shrubb built 1967 Geoffrey Butler.
I used to walk past Butler's shop every day on my way to school-usually going in on my way home.
Your crankset and front mech look Nuovo Record, calipers look Mafac(?)hubs, can see rust so not alloy barreled...need better images (i.e rear mech) of components to identify without guessing.
You're on thin ice dating a frame from the components - i'ts touch and go whether Butler's were trading as early as the 1950s. Looks a 1970s (Holdsworth built) frame to me...kind of thing I used regularly see in the shop.
Geoffrey Butler is no relation to either Claud or Stan.
It's big though.
Roadking.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 2:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 5:27 am
Posts: 100
Location: Sydney
I reckon the GB is a better buy than the Moser (although it clearly depends on price).

I can't see a lip on those cranks. I hope they are '58s though. I have my doubts though. Front deraileur does look like a 1960s model, so it's not going to be far off. Can't recognise anything else clearly enough to date from the pics I can see.

Good score!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:33 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:07 pm
Posts: 1323
Location: Cotswolds
What sort of wheel builder didn't file off the tops of the spoke nipples?
Looks like a wood insert, could be Weinmann (11 ounce) other makes Scheeren (8 ounce) unlikely Mephisto (heavier).


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 2:34 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 11:36 pm
Posts: 551
Location: Liverpool
Hi again Roadking "Nice isn't she ?" :-) I am about 90% certain she is a genuine GB, but age, until I get it in my hands, is a guess my friend. Its certainly got certain hallmarks of being an oldie.

Hi Toff, nice to meet you buddy :-) The front mech appears to have the very long clamping bracket in 1 of the pics I have. IF it is then that puts it 1st gen Nuovo from the late 50's early 60's.

The hubs (especially the rusty front) are spot on for the early steel versions. Seeing the rust is comforting :-) Rear appears to be the later 60's with oil ring and looks to be LF BUT without the holes ?

Both skewers are campagnolo 60's. Know those pointy ends anywhere (not the rounder versions from later on) Sraight arms on them gives them away aswell.

Primo Extra Giro di Sicilia handlebars also indicate late 50's early 60's

Brookes saddle, campag BB, Fmech, Rmech, Hubs, Patent on the dustcaps. It certainly gives the feel of not being a cheapo slap-together.

I have seen the brake levers before, but twas a while ago & can't remember what they where. VERY excited indeed though my friend even without the lipped 58's, the cranks are likely to be in keeping with the rest of the build. Thanks for the input buddy. Laz

Hi Keith :-) "I'm guessing more that the rims are pre hollow section, but appreciate where you're coming from on the wood". If memory serves me right pre-hollows are late 50's ? and if they are, that will fit in with the rest of the build.

Thanks for ALL the input, "Tis really appreciated :-)" yours Laz.

PS: here is a blown-up pic of suspect 58 rim


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GButler closeup.jpg
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