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 Post subject: Newbie needs advice
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 10:44 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2010 10:29 pm
Posts: 18
Hi All,
I am new about retro bikes and I have never been much into bikes either.
Unfortunately now that I need a bike for my commuting I have realized that leaving behind an old Raleigh rapide, reynolds 531 frame, in one of my last moves was an utter idiocy.
So I am on the hunt for an old racer/tourer with a 531 frame and I am finding the search much more difficult than expected: apart from ebay and gumtree, can you suggest any other place real or virtual (I mean the web) where I could find 'the bike'?
Also, not knowing anything about current prices, how much should I expect to pay for an old racer/tourer with a 531 Reynolds frame? Does the quotation change much with the brand or not?
Cheers!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 9:54 am 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:55 pm
Posts: 8209
Location: New Forest, UK
Bike jumbles are a good start.

Essentially you will pay more for a frame built by a craft frame builder, not a big brand. They each have their quirks and following.

For a roadworthy 531-framed older bike from say the 1980's then you are looking at £100-300, depending on condition, desirability, equipment etc.

However, you will often find that a modern racing bike (say something like a Giant SCR) will be around £150, and it will take mudguards and be an excellent commuter / audax machine. You will also avoid the costly upgrade problems from screw-on freewheels, non-indexed gears, 6 speed, 126mm hubs etc.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 11:31 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2095
Location: Sheffield, top city
what hamster forgot to mention is that despite it's age, a steel 6/7/8 speed machine will continue to run when the more modern bike is landfill.

If performance isnt an issue and bombproof durability is, then go for the older, sturdier bike. If you plan to join a cycling club and/or do a chaingang, go for modern stuff.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 1:26 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2010 10:29 pm
Posts: 18
A giant SCR could be bought for 150£? I guess you mean a very used one....

Cheers for your answers guys


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 1:58 pm 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:55 pm
Posts: 8209
Location: New Forest, UK
The SCR was £400 new 5 years ago, so £150 isn't unreasonable. Typically it's the kind of bike bought by someone a bit lukewarm about cycling, that sits in the garage unused for a few years.

I don't quite understand why people think that modern bikes will all be landfill with steel ones still going. I agree that crashes will take their toll on carbon frames, along with integrated headsets (yuk) but modern Alu bikes seem to have got over the teething troubles of early years.

The problem with buying an older bike is the combination of 27" wheels, freewheel hubs, 126mm spacing etc etc. While it's all upgradable, it does cost a lot to do so. Bearing in mind the OP said he doesn't know much about bikes, and is trying to get something to commute on, it's a bit of a minefield to start. Plus, take it to any bike shop and they'll say it's cheaper to buy a replacement (and they'd be right).

I agree that a 1985 Dawes Galaxy is in many ways nicer than its modern equivalent, but it would take time and fiddling to bring it up to scratch for everyday commuting...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:37 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2095
Location: Sheffield, top city
hamster wrote:
I don't quite understand why people think that modern bikes will all be landfill with steel ones still going. I agree that crashes will take their toll on carbon frames, along with integrated headsets (yuk) but modern Alu bikes seem to have got over the teething troubles of early years.

I wouldnt fully disagree re the alu frames. However, modern wheels, bars, stems & groupsets are built for weight reduction and/or performance only. If anyone talks of durability, then theyre either old fashioned or a skinflint. So, ergos/sti's have plastic workings with limited life, youve mentioned the headsets, external BB bearings have short lifespans, need i go on. I still have the stuff from my racing days in the 80's which were until very recently on a winter bike. The stuff has now been removed and will form the basis of a "back in the day" racing bike. It all still works. Would be interesting to see if a modern racing groupset would function well in 25 yrs??

Quote:
The problem with buying an older bike is the combination of 27" wheels, freewheel hubs, 126mm spacing etc etc. While it's all upgradable, it does cost a lot to do so. Bearing in mind the OP said he doesn't know much about bikes, and is trying to get something to commute on, it's a bit of a minefield to start. Plus, take it to any bike shop and they'll say it's cheaper to buy a replacement (and they'd be right).

I agree that a 1985 Dawes Galaxy is in many ways nicer than its modern equivalent, but it would take time and fiddling to bring it up to scratch for everyday commuting...

depends how old. A mid 80's bike onwards, would have a freehub (albeit 7 cogs - and theyre readily available) and 700C wheels
I wholehartedly agree with modern is probably cheaper and much easier, esp for someone without the knowhow. Retrobike traders have now pushed parts prices towards new stuff. My new winterbike is now all modern shimano cos its widely available and not much more costly than specific retro parts. However, it performs like a racing bike with guards. I wouldnt want to use it as an everyday commuter - I'd take the weight and want something a bit more bombproof.
I feel that for the future, I will have left retro projects alone, to go with the flow of modern stuff and retro will likely be something I appreciate, but not partake in. A pity.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:46 pm 
Retro Guru
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 4:22 pm
Posts: 1481
pigman wrote:
what hamster forgot to mention is that despite it's age, a steel 6/7/8 speed machine will continue to run when the more modern bike is landfill.

I agree. Everything is maintainable, adjustable or reconditionable on the older bikes. The only bit that costs me money is all the shiny bits :D

pigman wrote:
If performance isnt an issue and bombproof durability is, then go for the older, sturdier bike. If you plan to join a cycling club and/or do a chaingang, go for modern stuff.

I disagree. :D I pass people on flash modern bikes every day on a heavy, late 70's 5-speed racer with slightly bent wheels. I don't think you need top kit unless you're really top end of racing, like you say.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 2:49 pm 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:55 pm
Posts: 8209
Location: New Forest, UK
I forgot to join in the grumble about outboard BB bearings! :D

Certainly there are always lots of requests for RH 1990s STI units, as they are not serviceable. I'm running a mid-1990s Campag setup and I agree that is it absolutely bombproof - and has grease ports to keep it in good running order.

The hard truth is that the 1980s stuff (and earlier) was a lot simpler, which makes it more durable and less finicky.

I doubt that anyone would want one of the current crop of electronic shifting gruppos in 20 years time... :shock:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 4:32 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:19 am
Posts: 2095
Location: Sheffield, top city
Jonny69 wrote:
I disagree. :D I pass people on flash modern bikes every day on a heavy, late 70's 5-speed racer with slightly bent wheels. I don't think you need top kit unless you're really top end of racing, like you say.

yeah, me too, when I'm on my 5 speed town bike. However, no way would I be able to keep up when my mates are trying. I think, we're kinda saying the same thing, but I'm just trying to tell newby that if he intends to join a racing club, then the steel bike will end up discarded after a short time in favour of something more modern. Whether we care to admit it or not, from a performance angle, the old stuff just dont cut it, but it will continue to roll on with minimum maintenance.
The choice of bike is not limited to 5 speed 70's stuff or top end modern stuff - there's lots in between.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:19 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2010 10:29 pm
Posts: 18
pigman wrote:
Jonny69 wrote:
I disagree. :D I pass people on flash modern bikes every day on a heavy, late 70's 5-speed racer with slightly bent wheels. I don't think you need top kit unless you're really top end of racing, like you say.

yeah, me too, when I'm on my 5 speed town bike. However, no way would I be able to keep up when my mates are trying. I think, we're kinda saying the same thing, but I'm just trying to tell newby that if he intends to join a racing club, then the steel bike will end up discarded after a short time in favour of something more modern. Whether we care to admit it or not, from a performance angle, the old stuff just dont cut it, but it will continue to roll on with minimum maintenance.
The choice of bike is not limited to 5 speed 70's stuff or top end modern stuff - there's lots in between.


Lots in between, that's a wise remark. OK so saying that I would like an all around bike to do my commuting, cycling on the hills (on road) every other WE for pleasure and possibly doing a summer cycling holiday, what should I get?
A raleigh record ace or a modern audax like you said the giant SCR or what else?
I would rate as more important reliability, durability and running costs economy rather than top class performance.
Cheers


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